Remove KDR

Dragonskin · 2013-03-20, 09:33 AM

So, with the news that you can reset your KDR coming I think it is a good time to talk about simply removing this useless stat to begin with. I brought this up in another thread and felt it was worthy of it's own thread.

KDR changes your in game behavior so that you only worry about making sure you kill more than you die. It prevents you from effectively contributing to your faction.

So here is a vid also talking about it and I think TheKoolaidLine nails it. What positive behaviors does KDR promote in a game like Planetside? Why is it a stat worthy of being displayed in the game? Because like DrankTHEKoolaid... I can't think of a good reason to have it.

Aurmanite · 2013-03-20, 09:36 AM

Most people playing shooters will always do everything they can do avoid death.

Removing the statistical representation of that will accomplish nothing. People who champion this idea don't factor in human nature into the equation.

Figment · 2013-03-20, 09:38 AM

Since there's infinite respawn, there's no virtue to killing the enemy more than they kill you. The only thing of strategic importance is killing the spawn points and then whatever had spawned. Suicidal tactics do that best in this game.

Elgareth · 2013-03-20, 09:42 AM

Originally Posted by Aurmanite

Most people playing shooters will always do everything they can do avoid death.

Removing the statistical representation of that will accomplish nothing. People who champion this idea don't factor in human nature into the equation.

I tend to disagree. I know I hesitate more when doing something suicidal to help the faction with K/D in place... I guess others are like me ^_^
I'm for removing K/D, it does nothing positive for the game IMHO, so the worst that could happen is that everything stays the same, with a chance that people will act more team-based.
Worth it IMHO.

Assist · 2013-03-20, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by Dragonskin

So, with the news that you can reset your KDR coming I think it is a good time to talk about simply removing this useless stat to begin with. I brought this up in another thread and felt it was worthy of it's own thread.

KDR changes your in game behavior so that you only worry about making sure you kill more than you die. It prevents you from effectively contributing to your faction.

So here is a vid also talking about it and I think TheKoolaidLine nails it. What positive behaviors does KDR promote in a game like Planetside? Why is it a stat worthy of being displayed in the game? Because like DrankTHEKoolaid... I can't think of a good reason to have it.

I think KDR is way overblown by this community. Most players with high KDR aren't the type of people who sit way in the back, they're just effective at using their surroundings. I personally charge in to every fight I'm at, I get to places unexpected and I try to work from an area that I can control. Most new players are not really playing to their KDR but more to the fact that in most games dying is considered a penalty. In Planetside 2, for some reason, it's not a penalty. You respawn and you're back in the fight. Once skilled players realize this they tend to be extremely aggressive because most normal players are very defensive to avoid the dreaded respawn screen. Defensive players are sitting ducks in Planetside2, though they don't seem to realize it.

Of all the stats that cause any sort of issues in the game, kills/hour and score/hour should be more of a concern effecting the play style Planetside wants to promote, not kills/death. If kills/death is effecting your gameplay than you're not maximizing the gains your character could be receiving. The only exception to this is Liberators, but that's because Liberators are ridiculously unbalanced to the rest of the game but that's another subject that Higby doesn't seem to want to deal with.

MaxDamage · 2013-03-20, 09:47 AM

It is a statistic.

It does not prevent you from doing anything.

This argument has been done to death.

Stop trying to dictate how others play and enjoy the game.

Hamma · 2013-03-20, 09:51 AM

Originally Posted by Dragonskin

So, with the news that you can reset your KDR coming

What?

Assist · 2013-03-20, 09:53 AM

Originally Posted by Hamma

What?

http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/i...e-item.106330/

Artorius · 2013-03-20, 10:09 AM

Removing K/D without removing Death´s solves nothing. You will have external statpages like PSU who will bring the K/D stat back.

almalino · 2013-03-20, 10:13 AM

What is the reason to remove KDR?
People who doesn't care about KDR will not notice.
People who care will leave? So we will reduce PS2 population. Is it the goal?

Gimpylung · 2013-03-20, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by Artorius

Removing K/D without removing Death´s solves nothing. You will have external statpages like PSU who will bring the K/D stat back.

What he said.

Dragonskin · 2013-03-20, 10:46 AM

Originally Posted by MaxDamage

Stop trying to dictate how others play and enjoy the game.

This is an interesting comment. So you do recognise that removing the KDR would alter how people play, but unlike you suggest it wouldn't be me dictating anything. The players themselves can still be kill whores if they wanted, but a lot of players might actually learn to be more objective oriented over time. How is that a bad thing? Or are you trying to protect a precious epeen number that doesn't actually tell people how good of a player you actually are?

Originally Posted by Artorius

Removing K/D without removing Death´s solves nothing. You will have external statpages like PSU who will bring the K/D stat back.

I agree and that is a good point. Remove total death count as well. Just keep the player kill board like the SOE version where it tracks the last 100 deaths and kills. That is all you really need to know and would give you a good idea how a praticular play session went.

Hamma · 2013-03-20, 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by Assist

http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/i...e-item.106330/

My bad, hadn't read the thread yet.

satori · 2013-03-20, 11:22 AM

This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. A purchasable stat wipe? Let's call it what it is, a $$ grab for SOE. Removing K/D entirely is a different subject (one that I'm not in favor of) but this just silly. Please, SOE, focus on more important issues rather than people whining about their K/D ratio.

Rolfski · 2013-03-20, 11:25 AM

The problem of K/D ratio becomes even more apparent as people build up and tend to care more for their character and its stats over time.
If you invested 500 hours to build up a BR 70 character with a K/D of 3.0, it's only understandable that you want your stats like K/D you carefully build, to improve, not to diminish.

It's the nature of persistent MMO's and a serious problem in PS2 because I see around me how it negatively effects game play. With the lack of any meaningful goals/meta game in the current game, this problem becomes even exponentially bigger.
Kill farming/XP farming has become a disease in this game, because frankly, there's not much better to do.

Does that mean we should remove K/D stats altogether? I'm afraid that won't work. Some people are more completionist than others and challenge themselves by stats like K/D. Making the game less fun for them by removing these stats would probably only piss them off. Don't expect them to become suddenly better and more enthusiastic team players.

What should be done though is change the relationship between K/D and XP/certs/levelling up. Rewarding people for objective play vs just killing stuff is still completely broken in this game. No XP for following orders, no XP for capping/holding points, defense XP system doesn't make people defend. Who cares about capping and holding some outpost while killing off a few vehicles and players around the Crown will get you a shitload more XP and will level you up/gain you certs 10x faster?

Give people a choice: You can focus on just killing stuff/ improve your K/D, but it won't level you up as fast compared to playing the objective.