Base Capture Mechanics

Dougnifico · 2014-04-03, 01:00 PM

So, taking major facilities is a bit lack luster and I had some ideas. I also have ideas for 2 new major facilities, but I'm not a base designer so that could be left to the pros. Keep in mind that this goes with the latest we've heard about the resource revamp (Base power for vehicle and equipment acquisition and a singular resource given to individuals.) So what do you guys think?

Sorry for long post. Not real way to do a TLDR. Also, sorry to Chip and Hamma. If you want to move this to the ideas section you can, but I posted here because that section doesn't get much traffic.

TECH PLANTS

Primary Benefit: Allows the acquisition of main battle tanks and liberators at major bases connected on the lattice.

Secondary Benefit: Reduction in resource and power cost for ground vehicles. (Bonuses stack)

Capture:
1. Destroy external generators to bring down shields and gain access to the main base.
2. Capture the center control terminal (manually) to begin a capture virus upload.
3. At half-way, 3 electronic defense consoles open up that can be destroyed to increase the speed of capture.

AMP-STATIONS

Primary Benefit: Powers bases connected along the lattice. Without an Amp-Station, bases must rely on reserve power and will not gain passive power regeneration while under attack.

Secondary Benefit: Add extra armor, more efficient coolant and increases hack times to base defenses. (Bonuses stack)

Capture:
1. Destroy courtyard generators to bring down vehicle shields.
2. Capture 3-5 control consoles inside the base.
3. Once the control meter is filled, a new underground area beneath the main base is opened up containing a central control console. This console must be captured manually and defended for a short period of time.

BIO-LABS

Primary Benefit: Helps to stabilize spawn control units connected along the lattice, increasing their overload and destruction times. Also decreases the re-spawn times in all base control rooms.

Secondary Benefit: Gives passive health regeneration to all soldiers on the continent. (Bonuses stack)

Capture:
1. Capture all control points within the Bio-Lab interior.

NOTE: I kind of like Bio-Labs.

INTERLINK FACILITIES

Primary Benefit: Enable passive radar arrays at bases connected on the lattice, causing sprinting attackers to be spotted on the minimap while they are in the boundaries of the base. It also causes enemy deployed AMS sunderers within a certain radius of the base to be plotted on the map.

Secondary Benefit: Increased spot and minimap location duration. (Bonuses stack)

Capture:
1. Destroy generators to allow access inside the base.
2. Capture control consoles throughout the base.
3. Upon filling the capture meter, a lattice link unit spawns at a point within the base. A friendly base connected on the lattice is designated, and the LLU must be taken to a point in that base to complete the capture.
Warning: LLU is known to interfere with aircraft avionics!

Note: Defenders can kill the person with the LLU and place a charge on it with a short timer. Once this time expires, the LLU is destroyed and a new one is spawned. During the LLU return, the defenders can attempt to re secure the base. Attacks must have the meter filled or the LLU can not be returned. If the meter falls below a certain point, the LLU detonates, killing the carrier.

*New Facility*
AIR CONTROL CENTER

Features: It would have a large elevated air pad and an air control tower with a capture point to allow for fun vertical fights. The tower would be similar in height to an air tower. The base also has vehicle shields, walls, and a air defense shield (dome shield). Above the base is a floating platform with no direct access from the ground (lifts are possible if balance isn't right). Rest is left to base designers.

Primary Benefit: Is the only place where heavy air vehicles (galaxies, in the future possibly heavy gunships and bombers) can be acquired. Also allows for precision drop-pod insertions from the warpgate. (Think of the old HART system).

Secondary Befit: Reduction in resource and power cost for air vehicles. Also increases timers for lock-ons to friendly vehicles. (Bonuses stack)

Capture:
1. Destroy generators to gain entry to base for ground and air vehicles.
2. Capture control consoles throughout base.
3. Upon filling the control meter, 3 more generators are opened up and must be destroyed, dropping shields to allow access to the sky-platform above the base.
4. On the sky-platform, there is a central control console that must be hacked and held for a certain amount of time.

Note: The defenders have access to several teleporter rooms to the sky-platform. The attackers must make use of galaxies and aircraft to access the platform. Air superiority is key.

*New Facility*
NANO REFINERY

Features: Several burnoff towers with buildings containing burnoff valves. It would look very gritty and industrial. Everything else is left for the design team.

Primary Benefit: Increases the individual resource intake for soldiers in territories connected on the lattice. (Bonuses stack)

Secondaty Benefit: None. Primary can be adjusted to power that is properly balanced.

Capture:
1. Destroy burnoff valves (same way as generators) that will disable the facilties resources benefit to the enemy. (Can be destroyed at any time on infiltration missions for deeper meta game. Burnoff valves cause explosions that will kill players when detonated, and evacuation window is provided).
2. Capture control consoles throughout the base.
3. Upon filling the control meter, the shields around a bomb will be dropped. This bomb must be taken to an area of the base, planted, defended, and detonated upon a timer to complete the capture. (Players will have a chance to evacuate once bomb timer has ended).

Note: If the bomb is dropped, the defenders may pick it up and keep it away from the enemy until the capture meter can be brought back down to a certain point. When this happens, the bomb deconstructs and a new one is placed behind the shields. If the bomb leaves the base area or enters a spawn room, it explodes killing the player carrying it.

Azzzz · 2014-04-04, 07:52 AM

Can't say I disagree with any of this simply because you add various modes from other FPS games into a consistent and on going battle. Adds a different feel to the game while giving something else to defend other than a point. And it makes the facilities more important to attack/hold. I foresee this making squad Ops even more engaging because it gives them missions that would actually matter.

New and shiny things are always interesting.

And...I actually agree with you on something.

Dougnifico · 2014-04-04, 08:02 AM

I know! Shocking right...

But ya, I figure each is based on popular FPS game modes.

Ampstation = Conquest Assault, Carrier Assault
Tech Plant = Conquest with a twist, Hack and Hold
Bio Lab = Domination
Interlink = Capture the Flag
Air Control = Titan from BF2142 mixed with Air Superiority
Refinery = Bomb, Obliteration, Search and Destroy

It adds variety to the mix.

CraazyCanuck · 2014-04-04, 08:42 AM

OK now go beat SoE into submission and get this implemented ASAP!

Taramafor · 2014-04-04, 10:06 AM

I might not go for exactly everything stated here (eg: continent wide regen, though in the biolab area then perhaps), but damn, I agree with at least a good 80% of it. For one simple reason. It gives the bases OBJECTIVES and MEANING which is servilely lacking in this game and which is what is causing people to get bored of the constant attack/wait at X base along the line at every base no matter what type of base it is.

Long story short, it would make bases feel like different bases instead of just useless ground to fight over which currently gives next to zero strategic meaning.

bpostal · 2014-04-04, 10:33 AM

The ONLY thing I would question would be the stacking of the bennies. Naturally, it supports the overpopped faction as one would assume they've got more of a given base type, this could be a sticking point. On one hand, it pays to win, on the other the benefits shouldn't stack to the point where an underpopped faction is placed on an even more unstable footing.

The benefits themselves look pretty good, and they most certainly give players a reason to go after (or defend to the death) a given type of facility.

The LLU should really make a comeback! The interlink, as you've posted, is a great place to start it up as it forces the offensive faction to secure TWO geographically separate areas, such that a smart faction can divide and conquer even if they don't have equal pops.

The nano-refinery sounds cool! I'd love to fight over it (and blow it up!) and the bennie from Air Control Center (HART drops) is awesome! It would need SOIs implemented (Base 'em off the no deploy zones?) but I'm all for it.

Boomzor · 2014-04-04, 10:42 AM

On the whole it's a nice write-up and could add tons of fun to the game, but it again hinges on the base design (which you admittedly said wasn't what the thread was about).

It's not going to change much if you get zephyr spammed on the way to a capture point or get zephyr spammed on your way to a defence console.

With that in mind, we need more things to make the capture matter - other than more XP.
(I also disagree with benefit-stacking. Having a second as a redundancy and robbing the opponent of theirs is probably reward enough).

Dougnifico · 2014-04-04, 05:23 PM

Well, benefits don't have to stack, but they were for the continent, not the world. So worst case you get 3 stacks. Continents could have separate benefits that I haven't thought about. I thought if they stack, as your faction takes over a continent, you would get a personal sense of growing power without breaking the game.

And I'm not a base designer, but these are more just design goals. Current facilities should only have to get minor changes. SOI should come back absolutely, no doubt about that. On the point of air spam, the AirCon Center was actually an idea I had where it would be air defended, but air superiority is a very key aspect of winning the battle.

I figured these game modes aren't difficult for the masses to figure out, but at the same time they give advantage to outfits working as a team and make it so that an under-popped faction still has a fighting chance if they have a few good people working together. Also, these objectives would hopefully give rise to "accidental teamwork."

Oh, and the continent wide regen would be that slow effect that happens after a certain amount of time.
Tier 1: After 20 seconds, 1 min to full health
Tier 2: After 15 seconds, 50 sec to full health
Tier 3: After 12 seconds, 40 sec to full health
Not exact, just an example. And it would only work if you are on the lattice with the labs connected.

Ohaunlaim · 2014-04-05, 12:50 AM

Not bad. I agree all the bases need more impact, game-wise, when captured or lost. Your suggestions aren't perfect, but they are very very good starting places.

The tech plant benefit is too powerful. As it has stood for a long time the liberator (under most situations) can make a huge impact on a battle. Tanks are also powerful but require much higher numbers to make the same impact. I would suggest tech plants allow for liberator acquisition, but don't affect tank purchases, except via secondary benefits. That, in my mind, would give the tech plant benefits only about as much worth as the others you suggest.

The floaty platform wouldn't work if the only access was via the air. All that the defenders would need to dominate a defense would be for everybody to get AA and have a party. You would need some areas of access for ground troops in order to force defenders to both split between AA and AI and also to divide their attention from simply killing aircraft. A couple of teleport rooms like those in bio labs might do the trick.

Not a fan of the "bomb" mechanic in the factory. I understand, and appreciate that you're looking for another capture method for variety's sake, but it doesn't feel like it belongs in the Planetside universe.

As for the stacking, I will agree with others that say it will likely tend towards steamrolling the loosing side. This isn't much of a big deal, now, with permanent warpgates for each faction on every continent. But (please god soon) when the intercontinental lattice and cont locking comes around it will be much more difficult to push into a fully owned continent. Defenders would have overwhelming advantage.

I would suggest these secondary benefits only come into play when owning a second base. Owning a third base would do nothing but deny an enemy of a primary benefit. Also, you wouldnt need a secondary nano-factory benefit in this case since you could simply state that there would only be one per continent.

bpostal · 2014-04-05, 01:04 AM

Originally Posted by Dougnifico

Well, benefits don't have to stack, but they were for the continent, not the world. So worst case you get 3 stacks. Continents could have separate benefits that I haven't thought about. I thought if they stack, as your faction takes over a continent, you would get a personal sense of growing power without breaking the game.

And I'm not a base designer, but these are more just design goals. Current facilities should only have to get minor changes. SOI should come back absolutely, no doubt about that. On the point of air spam, the AirCon Center was actually an idea I had where it would be air defended, but air superiority is a very key aspect of winning the battle.

I figured these game modes aren't difficult for the masses to figure out, but at the same time they give advantage to outfits working as a team and make it so that an under-popped faction still has a fighting chance if they have a few good people working together. Also, these objectives would hopefully give rise to "accidental teamwork."

Oh, and the continent wide regen would be that slow effect that happens after a certain amount of time.
Tier 1: After 20 seconds, 1 min to full health
Tier 2: After 15 seconds, 50 sec to full health
Tier 3: After 12 seconds, 40 sec to full health
Not exact, just an example. And it would only work if you are on the lattice with the labs connected.

Okay, that makes more sense. I guess I should have figured that you were talking about the continental level rather than the global.
As long as it's not overbearing then you're absolutely right, it can help the sense of accomplishment while not being insurmountable.

I'm also still on board with your 'Scarred Mesa Skydock' style facility but Ohaunlaim has a point, Bursters and Grounds/Crows/Nemisis(?) cost next to nothing, resource wise, when compared to a Gal or other style of aircraft. After a few good pushes, the assaulting force will be drained of air resources with the current resource mechanic. My guess is that this will be less of an issue when the revamped resource system comes out but who knows?

The only suggestion I have in this regard would be a decentralized style facility (Think Amp Station, but in the air and with no floor) that's interconnected via bridges (NOT jump pads! Bridges give both sides a more dynamic fight in the push/pull across them) for the ACC.

Dougnifico · 2014-04-05, 07:26 AM

Ya. It doesn't have to be a centralized platform. I'm not a base designer. I just thought it would be cool to have a way for air power to play a major role in the base capture. There could be ground routes, but they may be like teleporters or lifts (like I said, thought it might be a balance issue) that would unlock after the prior stage. If base design would allow, it should be made so aircraft have a major effect on this last stage.

Maybe you would have to use galaxies to get up there to unlock teleporters. Keep in mind, its the attackers that need to take the platform, by which point you should have control of the base below. They could be forced to engage the enemy in the open with AA leading to a slugging match between ESF's and Libs vs AA. A big difference is that its in the sky so air has many more attack routes.

Also, all this is with the updated resource system. Otherwise the benefits are almost all meaningless.

Ohaunliam, I actually really like that idea of secondary only applying when you get a second. Again, it would be minor bonuses to feel like you're increasing in power. I figure the attacking side get a huge advantage in the first place as they get a headstart and get to control the flow of battle. But hey, if it doesn't work, it doesn't work and thus would have to get cut.

NewSith · 2014-04-06, 10:19 AM

Originally Posted by Boomzor

On the whole it's a nice write-up and could add tons of fun to the game, but it again hinges on the base design (which you admittedly said wasn't what the thread was about).

It's not going to change much if you get zephyr spammed on the way to a capture point or get zephyr spammed on your way to a defence console.

With that in mind, we need more things to make the capture matter - other than more XP.
(I also disagree with benefit-stacking. Having a second as a redundancy and robbing the opponent of theirs is probably reward enough).

These are exactly my thoughts.

EDIT: "Making captures matter" is the sole reason the community sceams for inter-continental lattice. Moreover, I had a great amount of suggestions regarding this, here's a video.

CmdAtino · 2014-04-06, 11:38 AM

What if instead of the bonuses stacking up, you have to select which bonus you want as a perk on your character customization screen, say I want my light assault with slow health regen, I go to customization, but the health perk is cross out with the indication "Your faction holds no biolab on this continent", on the other hand if you hold several, a little number in the corner of the perk square indicates how many you own and hence that the effect will be greater, simple to understand for a new player (the higher the number the better, or depending if you REALLY prefer a certain one then go for it when available)
The perk icon would be in that empty slot where the implants were meant to go and if you click it they are all shown the same way the gun attachments are selected.

CraazyCanuck · 2014-04-07, 10:39 AM

If they had an air base they could introduce AA placements located with angles to cover underneath the base as well. And perhaps introduce missile based AA similar to what we already have now on the Lib.

This could also allow specific missions for air to complete. Think Star Wars and the Death Star sequence. The developers could introduce a high payload missile or specific nanite payload that aircraft need to deliver into crucial and highly defended areas on the base. Delivering these payloads would have significant impact on the capture of the base. They would have to forgoe their secondary option on their esf for this payload.
Some examples:
Open the way for ground forces to access the facility from below.
If/when they bring in automated turrets, they could allow air to shut them down.
Shutting down shields in areas that would allow air to fly in or drop troops into the facility directly.
Taking out radar and Electronic Countermeasures of the facility.

Dougnifico · 2014-04-07, 07:29 PM

All these are good ideas. I do like the idea to use base benefits as a customization. It could be like a second implant. One thing I was trying to avoid is directly giving more power. Could you imagine a vanguard stacking shields with the old PS1 buff? Maybe it sounds good to NC but as a TR player that frightens the crap out of me. lol.

Also, a lot of the weapon lockout ideas would seem to cause some confusion and frustration. If you pull a vehicle, then I believe you should be able to pull any of its attachments. Otherwise, it seriously devalues those items (which is not good for SOE from a business perspective). Also, lets say you lock out rocket pods based on bases. Many more people would pull things like coyotes. Sure, this encourages air to air combat, but it may just make it even harder to stay in the air.

If you want to have serious power from a base, you could look at a new forward artillery base, but there you get the problem of, "What the hell just killed me." (Side note, if you have a way for artillery to work that avoids this then you deserve a medal as that would be great.)

That buff in NewSith's video about free resto-kits is an amazing idea. Consider my post edited with it. lol

With regard to AA, I didn't want to put too much into that because its a very delicate balance between air and AA. If the balance can be worked out, then its a great idea to add missile defenses. I just didn't want to accidentally break the game for people with my idea. Many of my ideas are pretty conservative towards upsetting a 1v1 balance. Increasing lock on timers is a nerf to something many people don't like anyways. Putting AA installations under the air platform should be perfectly fine if that's what you're going for, but I'm not a base designer. I left design open intentionally to be flexible.