What we need for command

[StumpyTheOzzie]

Originally Posted by kidriot

edit: actually, the more I think about this the more I dislike the general idea. usually when you setup a plan and you start to execute it in a game like Planetside, something will hit the fan and turn your plan on it's ass, meaning you have to immediately adapt on voice comms and get people moving in different directions. unless the system they have in place can be shifted as quickly as I can get 10 dudes on Ventrilo to do something, then it's gonna be a royal pain in the ass.

That's tactical vs strategic.

I think the "command missions" everyone is talking about are more strategic. Expected duration in the tens of minutes to hours. "Capture that tower" or "Provide air cover to the armour column" This would make sense to have as a command mission award.

Tactical missions have durations in the seconds. "Hack that tower terminal" or "Red leader takes point, gold 1 left flank, gold 2 takes right flank, maintain speed of lead tank"

I don't think tactical missions can be awarded XP because the amount of time required to set up the "quest" would be longer than just doing it yourself.

[nomotog]

I kind of cringe a little when I see these huge complex command systems with many layers. I can just picture them blowing up because people will never listen to you.

The twitter command idea actually seems kind of good in a odd way. You could tweet status updates to missions and plans. We are under attack at outpost 13. Air support requested in attack on base 12. All these tweets would work like twitter and you could search mission updates for keywords. Like if you where a gal pilot you could search for #gal and see all the messages that involve gal support.

[ringring]

@ basti .... agree in the main ...
but c/ chat has been an important tool. (I know manitou said he'd never got cr5, which made me cringe)

c/ chat is your source of global intel ......

/c Hotspot Dagda ......
/c VC is there (basti and the mad scotsman, Kosh), got a couple of full platoons + others .....
(6 minutes pass)
/c 7 mins on the hack, are we going to get it back?
/c no
/c OC OTW
/c BRTD OTW
/c BL OTW

and so on ..... how can this be replaced with a mission system? I don't think it can.

Even though the command channel was so anarchic at times it was also social and different outfits and different leaders got to know each other and when the chips were down would work together.

Maybe a pl+sl channel?
Maybe an outfit alliance channel?
In order to reduce inconsequential command chatter each squad has a nominated comms officer. The SL is tactical lead and the comms officer (a flag on the squad details pane) does the comms. (actually I like this as it reduces/spreads the workload).

[kidriot]

The color coded platoons and squads on the map is necessary. It's the quickest way to tell where people are. As someone who led platoons seeing who was responding in a timely manner and who was fucking around is a reliable way to cut the fat from an outfit.

I don't see the practical use of more tacticlol map designs and waypoint detailing. Maybe for inter outfit stuff, but if it comes to that I'd rather roll with the 10 people I can count on then people I have to babysit through command tools.

That said I would like to see what other outfits are up to. Maybe command tree specific skills? Knowing who is doing what where on any given continent is what I really missed in Planetside 1. It was usually delayed through /c and I paid a lot of attention to hotspots.

That said, there needs to be a way that people leading squads can effectively communicate with each other. Hell, make command chat reliant on a command tree skill. Yes, it will be trolled and there's little you can do that's fair to control it, but it's a quick way to get info on what other people are doing.

Everything command related should revolve around the idea of giving information to the people who need it. The best way I found to move and control plattoons is through Ventrilo - we don't need tools beyond that for control, but we do need tools to see, in a glance, where friendlies and enemies (limited info, of course) are located.

[WaryWizard]

Basti and Malorn(tree) have pretty much nailed what you would need for commanding large groups of people. I'm sure there are a couple things here and there that could be added or improved upon though. If they were to implement this along with good outfit design, I could see two or three (large)outfits dealing massive damage to the other empires.

Assuming the other empires aren't as organized.

[NewSith]

Okay

Problem
Solution
Commentary

Lack of SqM numbers for coordination
Battlefield's "press on a squad member, see him on the map", just make it so corpses are highlighted also in that case. Plus high precision grid. Not just 400 giant squares, but like "I want OS on X:349.34, Y:120.56"
The reason for removing the numbers is their desire to "clear" the heads up display, the more pristine HUD is something I'm looking forward to.

Headcount limitation.
Now I think we should keep everything as it is.
The reason for that is that with new tweader system people will just gather zergs if they don't pass for a commander and try to set their own objectives. Not the way to be IMexclusiveO.

Specific objectives.
Make an outfit into one big squad.
I mean make outfits independent of squads, so they won't be just a tag infront of your name. Give them some standalone capabilities (yeah and I know there're specialisations already), have inner management so if say there's NewSith and SonicTHI and all they do 24/7 is gunning a Lib, provide an option to make them a "squad that can still be in diffrerent squads" so outfit leader can call them in when their strike team needs air support.

/c chat from PS Original.
Should stay.
PlanetSide did one thing right - global communication was a privilege, and the use for it was appropriate. Every time I play modern MMOs and see channels my face obtains curves of disgust. Probably if you want to force such power to commanders only, have an intercont /sl and /ol chats.

One more thing I'd like to add is squad leader should have the ability to draw on the map. Without grid restrictions.

[XPquant]

As a commander all I need in game are: A map that feeds me all locational intel my outfit has (enemy/friendly), a mission system to place way points with objectives for the outfit or individual squads, good quality in game voip for each squad with a dedicated leadership channel. Until the beta that's all I can think of.

[StumpyTheOzzie]

In one of the 3 other threads about command abilities Skyexile said:

i would presume the missions system would be setup with like multiple options to select or something so like:

defend X
attack X
destroy X
Deploy X
kill X Z
rally X

@

proximity of Y waypoint
At Y hex/hex cluster
Y objective

But then im not a game designer, i hope they have something more customisable worked out.

Which seems pretty much the obvious stuff...
As I was driving home from work tonight I was being chased by some sort of light plane for a while and it got me thinking...

We need to have some sort of "stay here for x minutes" too. Like "need 5 AA fighters to protect this armour column for 3 minutes" and "put gal here and for every 30 seconds you stay I'll give you 500xp" cuz you're the forward spawn point.

Obviously wait for beta, but I'm really nervous about how they implement this potentially awesome, revolutionary, genre changing afterthought.

[DaSwede]

One small request. Please allow client side dimming of waypoints so you can target enemies regardless where they are

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

[basti]

Originally Posted by ringring

@ basti .... agree in the main ...
but c/ chat has been an important tool. (I know manitou said he'd never got cr5, which made me cringe)

c/ chat is your source of global intel ......

/c Hotspot Dagda ......
/c VC is there (basti and the mad scotsman, Kosh), got a couple of full platoons + others .....
(6 minutes pass)
/c 7 mins on the hack, are we going to get it back?
/c no
/c OC OTW
/c BRTD OTW
/c BL OTW

Indeed indeed. Gotta add that to my brain now, and keep thinking about what the mission system really needs to offer, how it should interact wih Squads and Platoons, and how outfits tie into this, while avoiding the possibility of randoms trolling everyone.

[ThGlump]

High level leaders (dont know how to pick them ), should be able to create possible specialized missions to the pool (not showing to the zerg etc). Something like Resecure that, Capture this, Make diversion there, etc)

Outfit/squad leaders could see that pool of missions and sign for it - mission will be active for them. Leader should see how many squads/ppl are on that and can take mission from pool if its enough.

For every of those mission will be chat channel to coordinate with leader and other squad on that mission.


I would prefer this system over twitter following someone and passively accept any mission they throw at me. Keep that for zerg - they will like it.

[EVILPIG]

Originally Posted by basti

Indeed indeed. Gotta add that to my brain now, and keep thinking about what the mission system really needs to offer, how it should interact wih Squads and Platoons, and how outfits tie into this, while avoiding the possibility of randoms trolling everyone.

It has not been said that a Command Chat will not be something you can unlock. It's the Global Chats that are not coming back, at this point.

[noxious]

Originally Posted by Malorn

The twitter-like concept of following is quite terrible. Hate it for all the reasons Hamma and others have mentioned above...

[Truncated]

These are excellent ideas.

[Grognard]

I was going to say something in this thread, cause its a subject I think is important. However, Malorn more than covered exactly where I stand, so I just want to support that treatise.

[Aurmanite]

My only opinion on the twitter type following system is that it probably won't become a popularity contest. The best leaders will have greater success, which will lead to more experience/resources, which will lead to more people following them, which will lead to more empire coordination and success.