I'm going to miss the old base fights

[Figment]

Originally Posted by Aurmanite

There's no such thing as a career in a video game.

Carreer infil simply means a player dedicated to infiltration when playing the game.

I've seen some really badass cloakers in my day. I played with Raging Primates and watched osp420 going wild. My opinion of cloaking was formed having witnessed this first hand.

Cloaking will be much, much better in #2.

Having witnessed someone cloaking is different from doing it yourself. We will have to agree to disagree on what's better.

Personally I don't want a sniper rifle on a cloaker, because of how overpowered it'd make an infil. Even one that temporarily cloaks.

EDIT:

I want to make sure you know that I'm not saying you weren't a great player, Figment. I'm sure you stood knee deep in a pile of kicked ass. I'm merely being real about the limitations Planetside had. Bad base design amplified other problems with classes/roles/how the fight played out.

I'm not taking personal offense, I'm simply saying the above because you really, REALLY underestimate what an infil can do. The fast majority of PS players don't fully comprehend the potential either though, so you're not alone in that. I've exploited that fact all too often to not realise that.

Even with the exceptional choke points in PS1, people still failed to realise that a door that opens without anyone actually coming through, is not a bug.



But regarding PS2, I hope you realise the following effects on infil:


Infils in PS2 will have temporary cloak ranging from 15 seconds minimum to ...?

CCs are spread all over the base and you have to pass through large open sections, increasing chances of detection.

Extremely short TTKs now combined with being visible, a lot. What does that mean for escape routes and contingency plans? A lot.

No third person view to detect enemies.

No Router pads.

No AMSes for freedom of approach route away from the rest of the zerg (more predictable).

No complete freedom to determine inventory.

No Wraith (as of yet).

No Phantasm (as of yet).

No generators to blow or use as distraction that we know of yet an when they are there, they will impact less.

More vehicle pads (less impact of sabotaging them - is that even possible?)

Possibly no spawntubes you can kill (can you even get into the room before it's captured?).

Less equip terms from the looks of it.

No coherent enemy defensive line to bypass (more open and more chaotic == more dangerous for detection and requires to look out for multiple directions, but is also much easier to bypass by non-infil friendlies so what's the point?).

More chaotic, fast paced combat (less time to do your job before friendlies or enemies arrive).

No CY Prowlers to jack and create some mayhem with.

No ANTs to blow up or jack to make a base drain.


Instead, maybe I get C4 to insta-pwn tanks? Yay...? Boring and lame tbh!

Compared to PS1, what's left? Running from cap point to cap point and sniping at melee distance? Oh please. :/


It's a completely different infil game and I'm wonder what, aside from playing the quick scope assassin or scout, is there left to do? I mean we're capable of carrying weapons capable of fighting MAXes now. The entire role of a PS infil may have changed beyond recognition and tbh, I don't like the idea of that at all. :/

More nub-cloaker killwhores != better gameplay!

[Kalbuth]

Support is being banned from 2012 games, Figgy, didn't you know? It's boring, anyway. Too slow and useless, wtf are these people who want to do anything else than spawn, rush and kill in a super micro-tactical way, anyway? Who the fuck tries to think larger than micro-tactical in a massive scale fps, that's stupid.
Bow down to CoD style, the epythom of fps.

(Not taking a shot at you, btw, Aurmanite)

[Metalsheep]

I will miss the Base fights from PS1, i enjoyed them most of the time, both attacking AND defending. Its definitely where MAXs shined, able to lead the push through those bottlenecks to move the lines of battle. As a dedicated MAX user, one of my favorite things to do was to be the lead, or second in MAX suit on a door push.

I don't mind the larger, more open base design in PS2, i just wish all the bases had proper walls.

People always complained that Defense was OP, but that is just a rule of warfare, defending is always FAR easier than attacking.

Also: A single, highly skilled cloaker could break the back of even the most well defended, highly populated, heavily entrenched bases with a single, well timed move. It is always a big deal when a cloaker is detected or suspected to be within the base. That one player could completely change the tide of a battle if he really knew what he was doing.

[xcel]

I think at least one special base in the game with a centralized capture point and a 15 minute secure time would be a cool easter egg thing for the planetside 1 vets to enjoy from time to time.

[Knightwyvern]

I admit I probably will miss it a bit.

[T MAN]

Originally Posted by Figment

But regarding PS2, I hope you realise the following effects on infil:


Infils in PS2 will have temporary cloak ranging from 15 seconds minimum to ...?

No Router pads.

No AMSes for freedom of approach route away from the rest of the zerg (more predictable).

No complete freedom to determine inventory.

No Wraith (as of yet).

No Phantasm (as of yet).

No generators to blow or use as distraction that we know of yet an when they are there, they will impact less.

More vehicle pads (less impact of sabotaging them - is that even possible?)

Possibly no spawntubes you can kill (can you even get into the room before it's captured?).

Less equip terms from the looks of it.

No CY Prowlers to jack and create some mayhem with.

No ANTs to blow up or jack to make a base drain.

Instead, maybe I get C4 to insta-pwn tanks? Yay...? Boring and lame tbh!

Compared to PS1, what's left? Running from cap point to cap point and sniping at melee distance? Oh please!

^
This is what im going to miss from planetside 1, not the bases. Can you imagine having a gen on these new base and when you take it out or power drains out, all the lights that light up the bases would go out, "OMG that would be Awesome!" then it would make even better use of the flashlights and headlights.

Hope they are willing to add alot of this stuff that made Planetside, Planetside!

[Shade Millith]

Originally Posted by Rbstr

Yeah, none of those structures are worth shit with modern weaponry.

A modern fortified compound might be something like the US's Iraq Embassy: Just some thick concrete buildings and some walls. None of which would stand up to modern military equipment.

The reason they don't mean jack shit today is because we don't have a building material common enough or strong enough to build buildings out of that can withstand modern weapons.

But in game they're using futuristic material that seems to be impervious to weapons.

Which would mean those walls and a roof are suddenly elevated to the best defense against hostile invasion once more.

[maradine]

I think we can agree that's a function of not wanting to maintain and transmit state truth on every last cubic meter of earth in the game world.

[Malachi]

Bottlenecks were awesome. They'd be crazy to not have a few bases/maps that had some nice bottlenecks.

[Xyntech]

Originally Posted by Shade Millith

But in game they're using futuristic material that seems to be impervious to weapons.

Yes, because unassailable fortresses are the height of fun gameplay.

Bases in video games are designed to eventually be taken. If they are designed well, they will allow defenders, even outnumbered defenders, to hold out decently, but in the end, games aren't fun if players can never capture positions.

Also, there is no reason to assume that these buildings are truly indestructible. Lore covers a lot of things, but in this case I think we can ascribe it entirely to gameplay. Planetside 2 is already pushing technology to the limits, and allowing players to destroy bases and terrain would probably be impossible on a game of this scale at this time. Not to mention that it would be a complete mess as far as gameplay goes.

I don't have a problem with wanting reasonably defensible bases, but from what I've seen it should be plenty possible to defend these bases, especially when it's 300 vs 300, instead of the 40 vs 40 vs 40 or whatever they had at E3. Besides, we already know that jump pads aren't on every base and some bases have walls encircling the entire courtyard.

The least we could do is try some of the different bases out in live gameplay before condemning them. Remember: Gameplay comes first. I don't give two shits about a "realistic defensible base." If it doesn't make for good gameplay, it's not worth including.

Originally Posted by Malachi

Bottlenecks were awesome. They'd be crazy to not have a few bases/maps that had some nice bottlenecks.

Variety is awesome. I wouldn't mind a few places in the game with a ton of bottlenecks. Just so long as it isn't the norm. That shit got old fast in PS1.