Question about : Phantom Hacker

Demdadar · 2003-04-27, 04:28 PM

I'm not into the beta and i am not going into ( Waiting for the game , free bug version yay

) and i have got a question .

I loved the idea of hacking facilities and i also planned to take the ones there aren't people in . Now i saw a post about Phantom Hackers , calling them Anti-Social n00bs etc.

Now here goes my question :

What's wrong with taking a facilitie withouth no one in ?

It's a n00bazz question so don't excite so much

Angelos · 2003-04-27, 04:37 PM

Originally posted by Demdadar
Now i saw a post about Phantom Hackers , calling them Anti-Social n00bs etc.

Now here goes my question :

What's wrong with taking a facilitie withouth no one in ?

So you are saying you would actually consider paying a monthly fee to play a game alone? Go play a single player game, for free.

Warborn · 2003-04-27, 04:51 PM

What's wrong with taking a facilitie withouth no one in ?

Nothing.

Now, for the question you should have asked, 'what's wrong with phantom hackers?'

Before the lattice, you could hack any base on a continent that wasn't yours. So, what a phantom hacker would do is grab a fast vehicle, like a Mosquito, and fly to one of the bases that is away from the action (fighting was generally limited). There he'd dismount, hack, get back on his Mosquito, and fly to another base.

Meanwhile, the people who're the victim of the phantom hacker lose the benefits provided by that base, and need to go over to it to resecure it. By the time they get there though, there'll be a couple more bases to re-hack. And, best of all, the people resecuring the bases encounter no opposition at all. So, it's essentially a bunch of people chasing one guy around the continent, resecuring what he hacks.

If you can't see a problem with this, you're either a smarmy bastard who'd probably phantom hack himself, or you've never had it done to you. Trust me, it's annoying as hell to have to stop fighting and go to recapture a base that is totally empty, only to see two or three other bases that have been hacked by the same guy as well. It added nothing to the game, but took away a lot for those who had to deal with it.

rudenewt · 2003-04-29, 03:28 PM

Before the lattice, you could hack any base on a continent that wasn't yours

Ok, so now I presume you can only hack bases "in line" leaving the sole strategy of hey diddle diddle strait up the middle? Maybe this is why someone was complaining about "zerg war" earlier. Since I'm talkin out my ass cause I'm not in the beta I won't presume to know if you can take a base in the "rear" areas now but if you can't has the game just boiled down to a series of mass wave assaults on which ever base is next in line? That will esentially turn it into WW2OL with fancier gear and smaller fronts (oh, and a working program).

If you aren't going to guard the rear then it should be taken away from you. And if one side does it can't the other? Then both would have to guard rear areas (sure that's not fun) or loose benefits. I thought I saw a post somewhere that said the hacker would have to stay with his hack for a fixed peroid of time to actually turn the base giving the owners time to respond. What happened to that plan?

Rudenewt the unaffilated observer

gonnagetyou · 2003-04-29, 03:36 PM

You can still hack any base in in order you want. Just don't expect to get any major benefit out of it. There are still multiple base connnections, just a little more organized. I think the game is a lot better now.

You still see bases being taken behind the lines, but it isn't as bad as it used to be with all the boring phantom hacker chases.

Warborn · 2003-04-29, 04:26 PM

Ok, so now I presume you can only hack bases "in line" leaving the sole strategy of hey diddle diddle strait up the middle?

Clearly you aren't familiar with the word 'lattice'. Every base is connected to at least two bases. As long as you don't have only 1 base, there are usually 3 or so bases that you can attack from the bases you control.

If you aren't going to guard the rear then it should be taken away from you.

Yes, that's fine, but not as easily. With the lattice it's still very possible to take bases in the rear by destroying the facilities at the base and forcing it to drain its silo to auto-repair, thus eventually making it run out of power and turn neutral, thereby enabling you to hack into it. It's possible, but it's not easy, and that's exactly how attacking bases in the rear should be.

Destroyeron · 2003-04-29, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by Warborn
If you can't see a problem with this, you're either a smarmy bastard who'd probably phantom hack himself, or you've never had it done to you. Trust me, it's annoying as hell to have to stop fighting and go to recapture a base that is totally empty, only to see two or three other bases that have been hacked by the same guy as well. It added nothing to the game, but took away a lot for those who had to deal with it.

I personally don't like how they fixed this. I wish they would have left it alone, if someone wants to run around hacking bases, let them. Bases should be defended anyways, and there should atleast be 1 guy at a base to report trouble or somthing. It would show much more initiative to see "ok..he hacked here, and here, 3 go her, another 3 here, and another 3 here, we'll get him." and have a nice surprise when the guy shows up.

rudenewt · 2003-04-29, 07:50 PM

Clearly you aren't familiar with the word 'lattice'. Every base is connected to at least two bases. As long as you don't have only 1 base, there are usually 3 or so bases that you can attack from the bases you control.

Of course I'm familiar with Lattice. I have it with to-mot-toes and dressin almost every day. But that doesn't change the concern I had. You have limited avenues of advance (2 or 3) which are easy to react to and result in trench warfare. Fine I like trench warfare. But the point of highly mobile forces is to strike where the enemy is not. Can a couple of fully loaded Galaxys land and take a base not on the front line of the "regular geometric arrangement" or not.

Causing a base to go neutral is not the same thing as taking it for you side. I think the problem with your PHers may have been that they could cause neutrality without having to stick around. Perhaps the solution would have been to force them to turn it to their side or have the base revert back to the original owner. Again I'm guessing that they first caused neutrality during their hack.

At any rate I've decided to see for myself. Beta download will be complete in 5hours 39minutes and then I'm going to slaughter you all...if buffy the vampire slayer isn't one that is.

Rudenewt the unaffiliated observer (for another 5 and a half hours or so).

Warborn · 2003-04-29, 09:16 PM

Can a couple of fully loaded Galaxys land and take a base not on the front line of the "regular geometric arrangement" or not.

Yes, but it's not very common, because most people like to actually fight the enemy, which is what the lattice system encourages. In fact, enemy presence aside, it's very possible for one person (provided he takes a tower or has an AMS) to destroy the terminals/etc inside a base to the point where the base becomes drained of resources from auto-repairing.

Causing a base to go neutral is not the same thing as taking it for you side. I think the problem with your PHers may have been that they could cause neutrality without having to stick around.

I'll assume nothing and start from the bottom. When you hack a base, the base turns to your colours in 15 minutes, unless the base is at 0% resources (NOT the same as being unpowered due to the generator being damaged). In the example I used of forcing a base to deplete its resources, the reason you have to do that is because you can't hack an enemy base until it is no longer protected by the lattice. Meaning, the only way to take a base "behind the lines" is to wait until the lines advance to the point where that base is on the front line, or make the base Neutral. When the base is neutral, it's not the enemy's, and therefore isn't protected by the lattice, so anyone can hack it and, provided they refuel the silo at said base with an ANT, take control of it.

However, a better use of a mobile force would be to disable enemy bases prior to the lines moving forward. If you are pretty sure that Base A (which is linked to Base B, but at the moment protects Base B because of the lattice) is going to be taken by your side, you'd want to go to Base B and destroy its generator, terminals, and whatever else you can in preparation for the attack. Or, better yet, disable key enemy bases (ex. Techonolgy Plants) to limit their capabilities on that continent. If the enemy has an Interlink Facility behind the lines, try and send some guys over in a Galaxy or Deliverer and destroy its generator to render the base inoperable, and deprive the enemy of the radar/turret automation benefits the Interlink Facility grants.

Honestly, there are many uses for a mobile force, and those uses will only increase when the base control benefits are reworked in the coming patches. Still though, for those who want to fight the good fight with a real war feeling to it (though one with a few too many MAXs...), the lattice provides that and then some.

rudenewt · 2003-04-29, 09:49 PM

Thanks, that makes things a lot clearer. Actually it's reminiscent of that Michael York WW1 Zepplin raid movie. Now all I need is a Zepplin. Only 4 hours til everybody dies.

Rudenewt the unaffiliated Observer (just a bit longer)

Hellsfire123 · 2003-04-29, 09:54 PM

I think in a few days he'll realise that his arguements were false. Give him a bit of time in beta and he'll love the latice.

Kyoukan · 2003-04-29, 09:59 PM

Sure, the idea of having a phantom hacker on your side would be a good thing, but having to deal with one is... as they've said, a major pain in the ass. Just be glad that there really aren't THAT many of them out ther and hope this type of class loophole can get fixed... unless Sony leaves it around.

Angelos · 2003-04-29, 10:01 PM

The lattice pretty much fixed it. There is a frontline to combat and you have to fight aroudn it, but I notice that even if there are 3 places you can take, most people are around 2 of them at most. So you can still sneak in behind the enemy if you are quick enough.

Matuse · 2003-04-29, 10:03 PM

Bases should be defended anyways, and there should atleast be 1 guy at a base to report trouble or somthing.

Ok, so long as you are the one who volunteers to hang out at a base for 5 or 6 hours doing nothing on the chance that someone shows up to hack it.

That sounds like a LOAD of fun to me, I'm sure you'll enjoy it a lot.