Supression Effect - Page 2

Bags · 2012-03-08, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by Higby

So, I wanted to offer some alternative thoughts for how suppression effects can actually be beneficial. Its a gauge of threat. When you're being affected by a suppression effect, you know you probably don't want to stick your head up right now because someones about to shoot it off.

This adds a lot to something BF3 does very well, which is helps you recognize when you're under threat. This allows them to have extremely powerful weapons which do a lot of damage quickly, but it doesn't feel OVERLY punishing because you usually know between bullet whiz by, screen blur, screen shake, etc that you're under attack without you having to take damage to find out. Thats something we need to work on for Planetside 2 also. Now, for us that should be an edge bluring effect that doesn't obscure your main sight line, because you're going to be under a lot more fire most of the time. We don't want "suppression" to be something that actually hurts your accuracy and is tracked by the other team as a way to get points, it'd just get to spammy. But, it is a critical part of weapon power, threat detection, etc

Sounds a lot better than BF3's implementation. S'long as someone firing near me doesn't nuliffy my aiming that sounds nice.

DayOne · 2012-03-08, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by Higby

So, I wanted to offer some alternative thoughts for how suppression effects can actually be beneficial. Its a gauge of threat. When you're being affected by a suppression effect, you know you probably don't want to stick your head up right now because someones about to shoot it off.

This adds a lot to something BF3 does very well, which is helps you recognize when you're under threat. This allows them to have extremely powerful weapons which do a lot of damage quickly, but it doesn't feel OVERLY punishing because you usually know between bullet whiz by, screen blur, screen shake, etc that you're under attack without you having to take damage to find out. Thats something we need to work on for Planetside 2 also. Now, for us that should be an edge bluring effect that doesn't obscure your main sight line, because you're going to be under a lot more fire most of the time. We don't want "suppression" to be something that actually hurts your accuracy and is tracked by the other team as a way to get points, it'd just get to spammy. But, it is a critical part of weapon power, threat detection, etc

A good way to do this would be sounds like bullets making a super sonic crack, visual like screen blur at edge, and screen shake, as if your character is ducking away from the sound. Holographic sounds or as best you can get it will certainly help in this.

Duddy · 2012-03-08, 02:27 PM

Certainly as a means of notification and not a gameplay effecting mechanic I understand, and would be ok with, its use.

Alduron · 2012-03-08, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by Higby

So, I wanted to offer some alternative thoughts for how suppression effects can actually be beneficial. Its a gauge of threat. When you're being affected by a suppression effect, you know you probably don't want to stick your head up right now because someones about to shoot it off.

This adds a lot to something BF3 does very well, which is helps you recognize when you're under threat. This allows them to have extremely powerful weapons which do a lot of damage quickly, but it doesn't feel OVERLY punishing because you usually know between bullet whiz by, screen blur, screen shake, etc that you're under attack without you having to take damage to find out. Thats something we need to work on for Planetside 2 also. Now, for us that should be an edge bluring effect that doesn't obscure your main sight line, because you're going to be under a lot more fire most of the time. We don't want "suppression" to be something that actually hurts your accuracy and is tracked by the other team as a way to get points, it'd just get to spammy. But, it is a critical part of weapon power, threat detection, etc

The only issue I would have had with it was that my screen would have been blurred 100% of the time. I welcome implementing it as a notification, though.

TheRagingGerbil · 2012-03-08, 02:31 PM

No suppression effect. Its annoying, especially when you have an enemy like the TR who specialize in throwing as many rounds as possible downrange.

Coreldan · 2012-03-08, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by Bags

Sounds a lot better than BF3's implementation. S'long as someone firing near me doesn't nuliffy my aiming that sounds nice.

Should be easy'ish to toggle it off for friendly fire?

Hell, it should give you a buff to have your friend shoot near enough for you to get the suppression effect in theory! You get like "YEA, TAKE THAT YOU TR/VS/NC SCUM!" when you hear all the rounds going off around you too aimed at the bad guys

(joking, but still!

)

Bags · 2012-03-08, 02:33 PM

Originally Posted by Coreldan

Should be easy'ish to toggle it off for friendly fire?

Hell, it should give you a buff to have your friend shoot near enough for you to get the suppression effect in theory! You get like "YEA, TAKE THAT YOU TR/VS/NC SCUM!" when you hear all the rounds going off around you too aimed at the bad guys

(joking, but still!

)

Sorry, i didn't mean teammates firing near me, I meant enemies shooting bullets all around me.

Gandhi · 2012-03-08, 02:34 PM

Originally Posted by Higby

Now, for us that should be an edge bluring effect that doesn't obscure your main sight line, because you're going to be under a lot more fire most of the time. We don't want "suppression" to be something that actually hurts your accuracy and is tracked by the other team as a way to get points, it'd just get to spammy. But, it is a critical part of weapon power, threat detection, etc

I'd be happier with an audio cue, but I like the idea.

Zhane · 2012-03-08, 02:38 PM

It should stay on for friendly fire actually, since friendly fire still hurts in Planetside.

Shogun · 2012-03-08, 02:41 PM

keep it mostly to sound!

having blurred screen all the time will be more than annoying.
but hearing all kind of sounds bullets produce in movies will help with battleawareness.
bullets passing your ears very near, bullets hitting concrete or metal, straybullets... you know what i mean, just imagine any warmovie or cowboy film

if too much screenshaking and blurring is involved, give the option to switch it off. since it is meant as indicator and not as punishment, the players should be able to choose if they want the extra awareness or if they want to get rid of the annoyance.

Eyeklops · 2012-03-08, 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by Higby

So, I wanted to offer some alternative thoughts for how suppression effects can actually be beneficial. Its a gauge of threat. When you're being affected by a suppression effect, you know you probably don't want to stick your head up right now because someones about to shoot it off.

This adds a lot to something BF3 does very well, which is helps you recognize when you're under threat. This allows them to have extremely powerful weapons which do a lot of damage quickly, but it doesn't feel OVERLY punishing because you usually know between bullet whiz by, screen blur, screen shake, etc that you're under attack without you having to take damage to find out. Thats something we need to work on for Planetside 2 also. Now, for us that should be an edge bluring effect that doesn't obscure your main sight line, because you're going to be under a lot more fire most of the time. We don't want "suppression" to be something that actually hurts your accuracy and is tracked by the other team as a way to get points, it'd just get to spammy. But, it is a critical part of weapon power, threat detection, etc

First I gotta say, thanks for responding Matt.
So it sounds like there is the possibility of a suppression blur effect similar to BF3 but without the accuracy penalty.

A few questions then:

Will different weapons have different suppression blur levels?
Will there be side-grades or other ways to enhance to this suppression effect?
Does the suppression effect increase with the number of people shooting at you.

It would be an interesting dynamic if the amount of blur was related in some way to the amount of attention your getting on a grander scale. If just one sniper is shooting at your cover you get a light effect that doesn't bother you. But if you piss off an entire tank column the effect becomes so pronounced the only thing you will want to do is find new "not so hot" cover.

Raymac · 2012-03-08, 02:43 PM

I honestly don't think Planetside needs an artificial supression effect. I think the tracers from hundreds of enemies will have the desired effect, especially if you have kick ass sound effects. If you see a bunch of tracers coming through a doorway, you are not likely going to poke your head through there...especially since headshots are in.

SUBARU · 2012-03-08, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by Raymac

I honestly don't think Planetside needs an artificial supression effect. I think the tracers from hundreds of enemies will have the desired effect, especially if you have kick ass sound effects. If you see a bunch of tracers coming through a doorway, you are not likely going to poke your head through there...especially since headshots are in.

Agreed.I think this is just silly

Coreldan · 2012-03-08, 02:49 PM

Regarding what Eyeklops said, I think overall speaking weapons could/should have different suppression levels, but I guess that also comes with the RoF/longevity of firing. Like, an LMG is naturally gonna suppress you more cos it just keeps firing and firing at you.

I personally don't really mind the punishment-model either, mainly cos it's the only thing that really allows for true suppressive fire. The guy almost getting shot won't be able to just drop my friend running in the open cos I'm literally suppressing him and disturbing his aim. With a light suppression he can still take the perfect shot if he is fast enough. A game doesnt have a true fear of death, which is why such punishments were originally made anyways

The BF3/RO2 approach does have the appeal to me that it truely makes you take cover when the bullets start flying by cos you cant see much, you cant really aim, so if you want to live to fight it another time you just have to eat the dirt. If it's just a light suppression indicating taht bullets are whizzing near, theres nothing really stopping you from finishing what you started.

Buuuut I don't really mind. Planetside 2s scale sets it so apart from BF3/RO2 64 player servers anyways, buut still

As for the "hundreds of tracers having the same effect", I disagree, in games where there is no suppression, the only thing I calculate in my head is whether I'll have time to drop the guy before they drop me, they put no kind of "fear" or anything. Especially in games where TTK isnt low and LMGs often are fairly inaccurate. More often than not if you have the right kind of weapon, you can easily drop the guy suppressing you with a crapton of rounds since theres really nothing to stop you from doing so

Point just being, being suppressed with "proper" suppression effect vs. just being suppressed by a crapton of rounds with no suppression effects are nothing alike. I might not still go out there and take the risk in either case, but the feelings are two totally different things.

Bags · 2012-03-08, 02:51 PM

Originally Posted by Raymac

I honestly don't think Planetside needs an artificial supression effect. I think the tracers from hundreds of enemies will have the desired effect, especially if you have kick ass sound effects. If you see a bunch of tracers coming through a doorway, you are not likely going to poke your head through there...especially since headshots are in.

Agreed.