Supression Effect - Page 4

NewSith · 2012-03-08, 03:43 PM

On topic:

N.O. W.A.Y.

BF3 did the wrong thing by adding it. I don't think a typical battle-hardened soldier panics every time a bullet passes 10 meters near him.

wasdie · 2012-03-08, 03:51 PM

Originally Posted by NewSith

On topic:

N.O. W.A.Y.

BF3 did the wrong thing by adding it. I don't think a typical battle-hardened soldier panics every time a bullet passes 10 meters near him.

Actually yes they do.

Combat is far from what you see in the movies. When you get shot at, the most battle-hardened vet gets their asses down and stays in cover until their squadmates can return fire.

Also getting suppressed is not panicking, it's your basic instincts taking control and forcing you to find cover before you get shot.

SUBARU · 2012-03-08, 03:52 PM

Remember in PS1 .When playing a max defending a cc and some friendly cloker would come up and start stabbing you with a knife.It did no damage but it was annoying.Ths would annoy the crap out of me.The TTK is fast,if somebody is shooting at you, and you dont see it ,guess what? YOUR DEAD .

NewSith · 2012-03-08, 03:57 PM

Originally Posted by wasdie

Actually yes they do.

Combat is far from what you see in the movies. When you get shot at, the most battle-hardened vet gets their asses down and stays in cover until their squadmates can return fire.

Also getting suppressed is not panicking, it's your basic instincts taking control and forcing you to find cover before you get shot.

Thank for sharing. I totally didn't know that. But for some reason I was still able to hit target when was shot at.

SIDENOTE: HELL, even more - how can you be scared of dying in the world where you're immortal?

Forsaken One · 2012-03-08, 04:20 PM

Originally Posted by Higby

So, I wanted to offer some alternative thoughts for how suppression effects can actually be beneficial. Its a gauge of threat. When you're being affected by a suppression effect, you know you probably don't want to stick your head up right now because someones about to shoot it off.

This adds a lot to something BF3 does very well, which is helps you recognize when you're under threat. This allows them to have extremely powerful weapons which do a lot of damage quickly, but it doesn't feel OVERLY punishing because you usually know between bullet whiz by, screen blur, screen shake, etc that you're under attack without you having to take damage to find out. Thats something we need to work on for Planetside 2 also. Now, for us that should be an edge bluring effect that doesn't obscure your main sight line, because you're going to be under a lot more fire most of the time. We don't want "suppression" to be something that actually hurts your accuracy and is tracked by the other team as a way to get points, it'd just get to spammy. But, it is a critical part of weapon power, threat detection, etc

I feel sad that it won't be in honestly. But with the way PS2 is coming we can't have the 5 year olds and twitch gamers losing accuracy! whatever will they do!

Where did the whole emphasis of the game making you have teamwork go? You may be making a great game for Twitchers, but honestly its just purely stabbing the whole idea and soul of PS1 in the back. massive battles were not PS1's main attraction, WW2 online could do that. it was the fun and teamwork needed WITHOUT the horrid twitch crap meaning much that made the game fun.

I support suppression. it is a TACTICAL element that supports teamwork over rambo shit. As someone else said. its a great way to enforce flanking and other teamwork things.

As a note like in one of those last Videos you made. You were NC and you just kept popping yourself out of the door to shoot. Honestly. that was boring. Where was your team trying to come up behind them? where was the tactics? It was pretty much "push, push, push."

I love PS1 and I love teamplay. moving and shooting as a massive glob is not real teamplay or tactics. Are there going to be any elements other then some certs at all that enforce teamwork? and no, having "squads", "outfits", "etc." do not count. I mean enforced and encoded stuff in the game that make teamwork give more hardcoded power in the game over the guys that have the reflexes of 10 year olds.

Vancha · 2012-03-08, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by Raymac

I honestly don't think Planetside needs an artificial supression effect. I think the tracers from hundreds of enemies will have the desired effect, especially if you have kick ass sound effects. If you see a bunch of tracers coming through a doorway, you are not likely going to poke your head through there...especially since headshots are in.

Agreed.

Why would someone's vision go blurry because bullets were passing near them? I'll be honest, when there's a constant stream of tracers coming from around the corner and the constant sound of bullet after bullet whizzing past my ear, I feel pretty "suppressed" already.

Have it as a toggle maybe, but it doesn't sound at all like fun to me.

Edit: Bullets have a different "type" of sound if they fly near you, is that correct? I imagine that'd be the "thing" to turn into a someone's-shooting-at-you indicator.

Ragotag · 2012-03-08, 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by Sifer2

I could see taking some accuracy penalty when your actually being hit by bullets though. Unless your a MAX.

Yes! IMO, this is much more preferred than suppression effect - especially if the TTK gets slower. I would rather see ballistic/energy impacts foul up someone's aim; a real-time effect from taking damage. But then again, I would also love to see character movement rates, even their movement animations (like hobbling for cover) be effected by damage taken. If you have 5% health, it should be much more difficult to move, jump and aim - which would also promote the usefulness of the Medic class by healing people to return them back to full combat performance status.

Vancha · 2012-03-08, 05:19 PM

Originally Posted by Ragotag

Yes! IMO, this is much more preferred than suppression effect - especially if the TTK gets slower. I would rather see ballistic/energy impacts foul up someone's aim; a real-time effect from taking damage. But then again, I would also love to see character movement rates, even their movement animations (like hobbling for cover) be effected by damage taken. If you have 5% health, it should be much more difficult to move, jump and aim - which would also promote the usefulness of the Medic class by healing people to return them back to full combat performance status.

I'm not sure if it's quite what you're asking for, but I like the idea of getting shot in the arm reducing accuracy, shot in the leg reducing movement speed etc. It'd certainly give medics more importance.

Didn't they say the weapon would be part of a hitbox? Getting your weapon shot could cause it to jam occasionally or reload slower etc.

Ragotag · 2012-03-08, 05:35 PM

Originally Posted by Vancha

I'm not sure if it's quite what you're asking for, but I like the idea of getting shot in the arm reducing accuracy, shot in the leg reducing movement speed etc. It'd certainly give medics more importance.

Didn't they say the weapon would be part of a hitbox? Getting your weapon shot could cause it to jam occasionally or reload slower etc.

I was thinking along the lines of a much more simplistic model with movement speed & accuracy degradation being tied directly to your current health status. Movement animations (dragging a lame foot or hobbling around) would be a visual cue to your medic that you need some assistance. Think L4D/L4D2 style.

However, I like your model too.

Shade Millith · 2012-03-08, 06:27 PM

You know, we wouldn't NEED an arbitrary 'suppression' effect if instant rezing wasn't in the game...

You know, because being shot might matter, and you'd want to keep your head down? Hint hint?

Vancha · 2012-03-08, 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by Shade Millith

You know, we wouldn't NEED an arbitrary 'suppression' effect if instant rezing wasn't in the game...

You know, because being shot might matter, and you'd want to keep your head down? Hint hint?

It all ties back into the TTK...

NEWSKIS · 2012-03-08, 06:39 PM

In PS1, I think almost every projectile had a tracer. It was enough that even in PS1 it had a suppressive effect in that you could see tracer going by right next to your cover. It had that "keep your head down" effect without being annoying.

**Higby** · 2012-03-08, 07:08 PM

Originally Posted by Forsaken One

As a note like in one of those last Videos you made. You were NC and you just kept popping yourself out of the door to shoot. Honestly. that was boring. Where was your team trying to come up behind them? where was the tactics? It was pretty much "push, push, push."

Well, honestly, it was a demo - I wouldn't actually play that way in normal circumstances. It wasn't a bunch of people "playing" the game - no one was flanking, no one was trying to push us back, etc.

Fortress · 2012-03-08, 07:17 PM

To be fair:

1) A disproportionate number of you guys crowded around one entrance.

2) You got shot in the back by an overzealous teammate.

3) "Push push push" is the motto of every PS1 zergling/self-appointed zergling "commander" who thinks that dying=victory. The above 2 points indicate that you guys followed the "pushpushplan" faithfully.

So it looked like typical planetside play to me!

lolroflroflcake · 2012-03-08, 07:29 PM

Why do we need a suppression effect again? If you can't move or return fire without dying why do you need to be debuffed further? Sorry but this is a horrible idea. If someone wants to run into a hail of bullets let them, they will die in short order even without all these silly effects. I really hope this isn't being considered.