Drawn knife with OSK kill animation?

DayOne · 2012-02-08, 06:50 PM

The knife needs to be drawn as always but what if you could hold the left mouse button to do a super sneaky killing animation from behind the enemy?

Up/side-grade for infiltrators?
Quick time event for a chance to counter?

What are your thoughts on this?

Edit: I made another thread because this is not a quick knife. Yes, it's knife based, but it is for a kill animation alongside the current PS knife mechanics.

Also bare in mind that I was thinking about a fairly long animation, 3-5 seconds, that could be interrupted at any time, like HALO.

Rbstr · 2012-02-08, 06:56 PM

I know I'm starting to sound like a broken record, but can we at least try to not make a thread when ideas fit very well inside of those that already exist?

Checowsky · 2012-02-08, 06:58 PM

Remember when you used to have crazy cool knife fights in the Battlefield series....then it became the terribad I win button. Now its the laggy terribad I win button.

No, a) resource cost b) this is a frankly stupid feature in games I never understood.

You want proof it can make games less fun or even ruin them look no further than AvP. I always thought the animations were cool in all for about 2 minutes then it gets dull and it adds nothing but annoyance to gameplay.

Tasorin · 2012-02-08, 07:00 PM

Originally Posted by DayOne

The knife needs to be drawn as always but what if you could hold the left mouse button to do a super sneaky killing animation from behind the enemy?

Up/side-grade for infiltrators?
Quick time event for a chance to counter?

What are your thoughts on this?

How about they build a solid core client first that is not totally fubar, then you can worry about some desert.

Lord Cosine · 2012-02-08, 07:45 PM

QTEs can get annoying quick, plus with latency it can get frustrating. I smell that QTE fit better in single player games.

To make things clear in my mind a QTE is a 0.5s - 1s second window of opportunity with a Press 'X' To Counter pop-up.

I am sure some cool stuff could be done with knife fights, like if two people knife at the same time they cancel out, but the term QTE in general just stirs up bad images in my mind.

DayOne · 2012-02-08, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by Lord Cosine

QTEs can get annoying quick, plus with latency it can get frustrating. I smell that QTE fit better in single player games.

To make things clear in my mind a QTE is a 0.5s - 1s second window of opportunity with a Press 'X' To Counter pop-up.

I am sure some cool stuff could be done with knife fights, like if two people knife at the same time they cancel out, but the term QTE in general just stirs up bad images in my mind.

I know what you mean. What I had in mind IS a QTE but only one prompt from 0.5s-1s where if you push the melee button it cancels out their attack and maybe faces you towards them.

Neksar · 2012-02-08, 08:18 PM

No QTEs in an MMO. That's just bad mojo, IMO. Honestly, I'd be cool if there were no knife-on-knife mechanics, since Planetside shouldn't be melee-heavy. You have guns - shoot people with them. Infiltrators should probably be the only ones expecting knives to be useful. Again, my opinion, but a gun is likely going to help you more up close than a knife will.

Also, whoever said AvP was destroyed by assassinations was right. It became a series of chained backstabs. A backstab animation is a destroyer of competetive games - it got Dark Souls, it got AvP, it will likely ruin Planetside 2 if that's how they expect sneak attacks with the knife to work.

Warborn · 2012-02-08, 08:27 PM

What if a sniper could draw their knife and do an active reload event to shoot their knife through their gun, and if they get a headshot the server resets?

Talek Krell · 2012-02-08, 08:54 PM

If it were done I'd like the QTE version (for lack of a better way to give the player input), but I can't help but think that the difficulty of implementing it well may be prohibitive.

DayOne · 2012-02-08, 08:58 PM

Originally Posted by Talek Krell

If it were done I'd like the QTE version (for lack of a better way to give the player input), but I can't help but think that the difficulty of implementing it well may be prohibitive.

Just a simple "you have this long to counter" mechanic would work for this. From the attackers point of view they would be preparing to stab the guy when he suddenly turns around and slaps him in the face, cancelling the kill move.

Talek Krell · 2012-02-08, 09:00 PM

Originally Posted by DayOne

Just a simple "you have this long to counter" mechanic would work for this. From the attackers point of view they would be preparing to stab the guy when he suddenly turns around and slaps him in the face, cancelling the kill move.

I'd like to see them try a back and forth thing, where whoever messes up first dies. It might not work out, but it would be interesting to see.

Metalsheep · 2012-02-08, 09:05 PM

Originally Posted by Talek Krell

I'd like to see them try a back and forth thing, where whoever messes up first dies. It might not work out, but it would be interesting to see.

It does not work that well in practice. Mech Assault 2: Lone Wolf had a system where a player in a small Exo Suit could latch onto an Enemy mech and try to force the pilot to eject. When this happened a QTE popped up for both the Hijacker and the Pilot. Unfortuneatly this lead to Ping and latency issues, where one or the other had a superior connection and simply won the QTE with no problem. Even though on your screen you were fighting him off, on his screen he won already, and you Ejected from the mech almost as instantly as the QTE started.

With the natural ping and latency of an online game, QTEs dont work well against enemy players. The player with superior connection will always win, regardless of how good you are at QTEs.

Talek Krell · 2012-02-08, 09:24 PM

Originally Posted by Metalsheep

With the natural ping and latency of an online game, QTEs dont work well against enemy players. The player with superior connection will always win, regardless of how good you are at QTEs.

Blast. I was afraid that would be the case, but I couldn't recall any game trying it before. That might shoot down having any sort of "press enter to not die" thing at all, unless they can come up with a way around the latency issue.

Erendil · 2012-02-08, 10:14 PM

Because nothing says "serious online wartime shooter" more than a scripted attack animation and a pop-up that says "You are about to be assassinated. Press your Jump key to avoid getting killed in 3...2...1..."

Yeah.... No thank you, on several fronts. I can't think of any situation where I'd want any sort of direct PVP interaction involve QTE's, other than maaaaybe one for rezzing a fallen comrade to make the rez go faster.

Same thing for PVP interaction involving scripted cut scenes. They're acceptable for single player games and turn-based or instanced games where you see something at the beginning or end of the turn/match. But not for a real-time, persistent PVP-only shooter.

Lastly, no way should a knife be OSOK. I would hate to see the carnage wrought upon Auraxis from all of the instgibbing cloakers running about. It would just be way too abusable in a game of this scale where an attack can come from anywhere, at anytime.

And of course this says nothing of the latency and other technical issues Metalsheep mentioned above...

Talek Krell · 2012-02-09, 12:12 AM

Originally Posted by Erendil

Yeah.... No thank you, on several fronts. I can't think of any situation where I'd want any sort of direct PVP interaction involve QTE's, other than maaaaybe one for rezzing a fallen comrade to make the rez go faster.

I'd prefer a robust and varied system for melee combat of the sort that they're putting into War of the Roses (or Mount & Blade for a rougher example) but that seems like it would be rather a lot of programming work. A QTE would simplify the control scheme to be instantly useable without sacrificing the timing element.