Vehicles(artillery) and economy

Stardouser · 2012-03-21, 09:17 AM

Is there a list of vehicles currently planned for PS2? I checked the information thread and didn't see anything. I did find this http://wiki.planetside-universe.com/...ide_2#Vehicles and don't see anything that looks like artillery. Is artillery being considered for the game or does that kind of thing simply not go with this kind of game? I would think that it would, simply because if any game would support a slow reload, 5 mile range, indirect fire weapon, it would be this.

Also, I had not planned on making a topic about it but at the same link I posted above, a couple of paragraphs down, it mentions a player economy. Now, I imagine we don't know much about that yet, basically all I want to know on that right now is, did PS1 have resource gathering and/or an economy?

Hamma · 2012-03-21, 11:46 AM

PS1 had no resources and no economy of any kind. I don't think we have anything confirmed on "Economy" yet for PS2 so I may remove that. All we know is that resources are required for upgrades etc.

The list there is pretty accurate - there is no Artillery that we know about yet and those are all the vehicles we know about although we have not seen them all yet.

FastAndFree · 2012-03-21, 11:53 AM

It has been mentioned that tanks might be able to mount mortars as their secondary guns

Stardouser · 2012-03-21, 11:59 AM

Originally Posted by FastAndFree

It has been mentioned that tanks might be able to mount mortars as their secondary guns

Ah, now that's interesting. I assume the PS community is on the average, anti-casualization, pro-teamwork? BF3 has mortars but they are fired through a minimap system where zero teamwork is required, audiospotting forces all enemies to show on your minimap, you just point and fire. We had rather hoped that a second player would be required to spot for the mortar, but that did not happen.

I presume you guys would have similar hopes?

Geist · 2012-03-21, 12:04 PM

Originally Posted by Stardouser

Ah, now that's interesting. I assume the PS community is on the average, anti-casualization, pro-teamwork? BF3 has mortars but they are fired through a minimap system where zero teamwork is required, audiospotting forces all enemies to show on your minimap, you just point and fire. We had rather hoped that a second player would be required to spot for the mortar, but that did not happen.

I presume you guys would have similar hopes?

Yep. The Mortars will probably not be as powerful as the Flail from PS1(dedicated artillery), but it should require the friend with a laze pointer to use effectively.

Stardouser · 2012-03-21, 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by Geist

Yep. The Mortars will probably not be as powerful as the Flail from PS1(dedicated artillery), but it should require the friend with a laze pointer to use effectively.

Ooh, Flail, now that I know the name I looked it up:
http://wiki.planetside-universe.com/ps/Flail

Bring back the Flail!

DManTech · 2012-03-21, 12:22 PM

Originally Posted by Stardouser

Bring back the Flail!

I think a lot of PS1 players would disagree with you

I believe the devs have said that they want to minimize situations where a player dies and has no idea why or where it came from, which was definitely an issue with the Flail. Of course, they can't remove surprise and uncertainty completely, because that's a huge part of tactics and strategy...but I support them removing some of the instances where someone is able to kill another player half a continent away. And yes, if it's in the game, it has to involve teamwork, no BF3-style mortars please.

But as with everything else, we'll just have to wait and see in beta. I'm sure if it's something we all miss (or is in the game and isn't working well) it'll be adjusted.

FastAndFree · 2012-03-21, 12:26 PM

You could hear the projectiles hit the CY the entire time while you got from the spawn tubes to the door...
Let's face it the out-of-the-blue Flail Kill is mostly a myth

And in any case I would love to "divebomb" deployed Flails with my Scythe

Stardouser · 2012-03-21, 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by DManTech

I think a lot of PS1 players would disagree with you

I believe the devs have said that they want to minimize situations where a player dies and has no idea why or where it came from, which was definitely an issue with the Flail. Of course, they can't remove surprise and uncertainty completely, because that's a huge part of tactics and strategy...but I support them removing some of the instances where someone is able to kill another player half a continent away. And yes, if it's in the game, it has to involve teamwork, no BF3-style mortars please.

But as with everything else, we'll just have to wait and see in beta. I'm sure if it's something we all miss (or is in the game and isn't working well) it'll be adjusted.

DICE is apparently considering mobile artillery for an expansion and this is almost the argument some people over there have(they are worried more about it being "spammed" for free kills than exactly the not knowing where it came from bit). But if it requires spotting, then, while as a general rule I am against killcam, maybe people spotting for artillery could be shown in full for killcam, somehow, without going to a full killcam for other stuff?

Also, artillery hunting could be a great mission for aircraft...

Pozidriv · 2012-03-21, 12:47 PM

If we a re going to have artillery in any form in the game at launch im pretty sure it's going to be one of the following.

1) MBT mounted mortars or other indirect munitions.

Could be made as a short range indirect assault weapon or a more longer range tool (hopefully with a spotter mechanic)

2) Off map artillery via the "leader" cert tree (could be interesting :P)

3) Some deployable, perhaps combat engineer could set up something?

Stardouser · 2012-03-21, 12:53 PM

Wait a second...as far as dying to things you can't see to avoid goes, is PS2 going to have orbital strikes, and didn't people have the same complaint about it in PS1?

Pozidriv · 2012-03-21, 12:57 PM

Originally Posted by Stardouser

Wait a second...as far as dying to things you can't see to avoid goes, is PS2 going to have orbital strikes, and didn't people have the same complaint about it in PS1?

Orbital Strikes weren't that bad... untill everyone and their mother had em

.

CuddlyChud · 2012-03-21, 01:03 PM

In the beginning, orbital strikes were a lot rarer since you needed to have command rank 5 to use the big one. Also, since there was some indication of it being fired, if you were on the edge you could get out. The flail on the other hand was available to anyone who could afford to cert it, and there was no indication where the flail would hit. It became sort of spammy in that people would just fire at choke points such as doors and vehicle terminals. As far as using air as a counter goes, part of the problem was that often times people would set up in an opposing base, which meant they were surrounded by AA. The amount of effort it would take to kill a flail was often times not seen as worthwhile to the individual. Not to mention the fact that as soon as you killed one, chances are he would just pull another. Personally I think the flails were somewhat balanced in that there were limitations that you had to overcome to get one (either a cave link or a vehicle mod), but they just became really spammy once you could pull one.

Stardouser · 2012-03-21, 01:07 PM

Originally Posted by CuddlyChud

As far as using air as a counter goes, part of the problem was that often times people would set up in an opposing base, which meant they were surrounded by AA.

Was the range on a Flail so big you could do that, or were the bases that close toghether? If that was a concern, surely they could tweak it to prevent that.

Also, maybe the laser for spotting could be visible? Or perhaps...visible to people with the right spec?

Shogun · 2012-03-21, 01:08 PM

the problem with flails was, that when air superiority was lost, there was nothing you could do against 4 lazy flailspammers surpressing all entrys on a base.

and most of them even set up their flail at places where they could retreat into a warpgate or a capital shield where they were invincible. they kept spamming for free kills all day and when someone finally came to kill them, they retreated into the shields until danger passed and came out to keep on spamming.

there was a teamwork component, with a soldier marking targets with a laserpointer, but the flail would also work without this.

if we get artillery in ps2, i want something that cannot even fire until a laserpointer is used to mark a target.

edit for stardouzer:
flails could be setup in opposing bases to take advantage of the aa and the base shields