Outfit autojoin and other streamlining tools

Stardouser · 2012-04-21, 10:51 AM

I rewatched the GDC footage and this time I noticed Higby hit an Autojoin Squad button. So, I was thinking that when a person creates a squad he should have two choices; a simple create squad and a detailed one. The detailed squad create button will of course let the squad leader select several variables, one of which of course is whether or not to accept autojoin squad clicks from nearby players. And the simple create squad button will either create a squad to some standard spec set by the devs, or if you have custom created a squad before, it will let you choose from among preset squad configurations you've made. For people who regularly squad lead, it should even be possible to configure it so that their squad is automatically formed upon logging in.

And now, that all gave me another idea. So, Higby was talking about streamlining the MMO aspects so there isn't a learning curve just to get into a squad. Well, on to the eponymous topic of the thread; I was thinking that when an outfit is created the leader should have the option of creating perhaps a "time profile", ie the active time of day they expect to play on weekdays(weekends I assume are balls to the wall), for example, between 6 PM and 10 PM EST. Players will have this option as well. And outfits can also choose to turn on "accept autojoins", and players will be able to hit "autojoin outfit", and for people who have filled out time profiles it will attempt to match, otherwise it will just assign you to an outfit that needs filling.

I understand that some elite outfits will want to carefully recruit and they should be able to do so. People who just want to get up and running fast should be able to do that too. Why should new players have to sit around /chatting "any outfits recruiting"? Now, I do not know what motivation drives the majority of the people who go around saying "I don't want to have to join an outfit to do well", but I do know that at least some of them just don't want to have to do the MMORPG thing where you have to suck up to a guild. This isn't an MMORPG, every outfit should be at least somewhat serious about playing, whereas in an RPG the elite guilds you have to suck up to are the endgame raiders, usually, and family guilds that just putter around the game will usually just invite you. Anyway, this helps avoid that.

And, outfit text comms. Hopefully there will be voice comms, but as for text comms, I can't say I really like PS1's system of using your mouse to go to the chatbox. I kinda like EQ where you just hit enter and it takes you right to the chat window to where you can type, and it defaults to whatever default channel you specified(/say, /group, /guild, /ooc, whatever). But I don't know if that works here? Enter will no doubt be used on spawn screens and vehicle selection screens, but maybe when you are NOT at one of those screens it can indeed be used to send you to your default chat window? Or, should it be more like a modern shooter and J for global, K for outfit, L for squad?

Anyway, I saw the autojoin squad feature, and I haven't seen anything about autojoining outfits, and I thought that would be a great addition.

ringring · 2012-04-21, 11:02 AM

I would think that all oufits will want to 'accept' new players via a positive action. By that I mean all outfits will have a set of rules / customs that new member should abide by and they should confirm they will before they become full a member.

At the same time whoever, invited them should be a 'mentor' should they require it.

The point I am getting to is that if someone new joins your outfit there should always be a certain mimimum that they should be told and have to accept. If they don't they've joined the wrong outfit and the outfit has recruited the wrong person.

Examples:
Use of voice chat
Language (ie French / German / English speaking)
Participation in outfit forums
Expectations on outfit squadding
Leading and commanding
Comforming to orders / leader requests
Useful certifications

.. and so on.

Stardouser · 2012-04-21, 11:08 AM

And right there, I think you've described a reason why some new players won't want to join outfits. They want to get together with others to play but not be told what to do. With an outfit autojoin feature, players who aren't interested in mandated voice comms et al can form their own outfit and this will allow like-minded players to join. I mean, obviously outfits that are going to issue demands like you listed will not use the accept autojoin feature, and outfits that are using it are, almost by definition, not going to be like that.

Note that I'm not saying you're wrong. You're not; but this is one casualization that I think we should all get behind. Players being able to get into the social aspects easier will keep people playing better.

Although, everything you just described could also go into Outfit Recruiting Profiles. And for players as well.

Insanekanifer · 2012-04-21, 11:14 AM

Originally Posted by Stardouser

And right there, I think you've described a reason why some new players won't want to join outfits. They want to get together with others to play but not be told what to do. With an outfit autojoin feature, players who aren't interested in mandated voice comms et al can form their own outfit and this will allow like-minded players to join. I mean, obviously outfits that are going to issue demands like you listed will not use the accept autojoin feature, and outfits that are using it are, almost by definition, not going to be like that.

Note that I'm not saying you're wrong. You're not; but this is one casualization that I think we should all get behind. Players being able to get into the social aspects easier will keep people playing better.

Although, everything you just described could also go into Outfit Recruiting Profiles. And for players as well.

And thats why if they want to get serious and are fighting and doing things they only get to see in battles like massive gal drops etc, they suck it up and learn how to play as a team. Auto Outfit is just stupid. As a leader of an outfit I want only specific people, with specific mind sets. I don't care if its elitest, its my outfit.

On contrast there will most likely be "Zerg" outfits that will recruit anyone and have no rules. So most likely the newbies will join those. We also call these social outfits :P

Edit: Didn't realize you said have it toggleable on and off. Ignore my post and carry on

Edit #2: In most scenarios if you want to join the elite outfits there will be some sucking up or extreme requirements to join. It comes with the simple fact of supply and demand. People want to join the outfit that produces the most, looks the most bad ass and conquers the planet. Although this is not a MMORPG, this is a MMOFPS, with all the same social aspects. Guilds have ranking systems and thus, sucking up will happen, just as it does in normal military.

Stardouser · 2012-04-21, 11:15 AM

Originally Posted by Insanekanifer

And thats why if they want to get serious and are fighting and doing things they only get to see in battles like massive gal drops etc, they suck it up and learn how to play as a team. Auto Outfit is just stupid. As a leader of an outfit I want only specific people, with specific mind sets. I don't care if its elitest, its my outfit.

On contrast there will most likely be "Zerg" outfits that will recruit anyone and have no rules. So most likely the newbies will join those. We also call these social outfits :P

So how hard will it be for your outfit's leader to uncheck "allow autojoins"?

Edit- ha, saw your edit!

Blackwolf · 2012-04-21, 11:26 AM

IIRC PS1 added a "new outfit" that new characters automatically joined.

PS1 also already had auto squading. An SL could check whether he wanted auto joins or not, a player could bring up a list of squads and join any that were accepting auto joins without bothering the SL. The SL could even have limitations on what certs he wants and so on and so fourth. As well as a quick "this is who we are, everyone's welcome" which served well for outfit recruitment since players looking for an outfit but not willing to just join any blindly could regularly team with one and make the decision on his own.

I honestly don't see why outfits couldn't have the same set up. A player joins the game, looks up what outfits are "recruiting" and checks out required details written out by the OL. If he likes what he see's he can enlist himself into an initiate's position and from there make a name for himself in the outfit.

This would probably cut down on the OL recruiting broadcasts that are fairly annoying.

Goku · 2012-04-21, 11:29 AM

I don't like the idea of auto joins even if its disabled or not. I think having a outfit window in game for people to look over and message recruitment officers is the best route to go. Even with a profile setup I don't see this being in the best interest of new players just auto joining outfits. There is just so many issues with this auto join coming to my mind, its too many to list.

DviddLeff · 2012-04-21, 11:43 AM

I want to see players able to apply to outfits - automatically accepting them seems like a good option if the outfit wishes.

Blackwolf · 2012-04-21, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by Goku

I don't like the idea of auto joins even if its disabled or not. I think having a outfit window in game for people to look over and message recruitment officers is the best route to go. Even with a profile setup I don't see this being in the best interest of new players just auto joining outfits. There is just so many issues with this auto join coming to my mind, its too many to list.

Maybe you could pick your top 3? Just saying "too many to list" pretty much implies you've got nothing but personal opinions. Especially when countering a completely optional system that neither newbie (who probably wouldn't even know he could look up outfits) or outfit leader has to partake in.

Goku · 2012-04-21, 11:46 AM

Originally Posted by DviddLeff

I want to see players able to apply to outfits - automatically accepting them seems like a good option if the outfit wishes.

I don't have a problem with this. If a player overlooks everything then proceeds to auto enter this way. I don't want a button that automatically looks for a outfit out of a pool of X number then places it with them.

ringring · 2012-04-21, 11:51 AM

Originally Posted by Stardouser

And right there, I think you've described a reason why some new players won't want to join outfits. They want to get together with others to play but not be told what to do. With an outfit autojoin feature, players who aren't interested in mandated voice comms et al can form their own outfit and this will allow like-minded players to join. I mean, obviously outfits that are going to issue demands like you listed will not use the accept autojoin feature, and outfits that are using it are, almost by definition, not going to be like that.

Note that I'm not saying you're wrong. You're not; but this is one casualization that I think we should all get behind. Players being able to get into the social aspects easier will keep people playing better.

Although, everything you just described could also go into Outfit Recruiting Profiles. And for players as well.

There always were people that didn't want to join outfits, that's fine although they're missing a lot, and I mean a lot.

What you seem to be describing (to me) is an outfit that isn't an outfit. What is the purpose of an outfit that is simply a bunch of what would appear to be disorganised people?

A real outfit should have some kind of organisation. The outfit that I beloing to did and we never considered ourselves elite by any means.

Back to the point, I don't see it and I'd prefer development time to be invested elsewhere.

SniperSteve · 2012-04-21, 12:00 PM

There needs to at least be a way to disable people from auto-joining. When BWC runs some of our operations, for example, we run it very strict, and extra people in the squad would really foul things up.

Hopefully most things in the game default to the 'newbie friendly' settings, but there is an 'advanced' tab for those who really want to get into the nitty-gritty details.

So by default, you just enter a squad name and hit create or whatever, and default it is auto-join and everything. But if you were to go to the advanced tab, there you would see all the fancy stuff like disable auto-joining, squad home base, squad description, squad boosts/whatever..

Hopefully the same would go for outfits. I would love to see an EXTENSIVE outfit management system. Perhaps complete with an events calendar, outfit home base, outfit description, an example image of the outfit camo pattern, ranks, detailed outfit statistics (totals (members, outfit points, kills, deaths, captures, resources, resource rate, etc), stats('prime time' [8:00-11:00 M-F, 3:00-9:30 Sat&Sun], percentage of outfit members with X cert, computed primary outfit role [mechanized infantry - computed because of large number of time spent in galaxy and MAX/Rexo use time <--fun algorithm for an intern to write], outfit rating[top %10 percentile {computed from points, kills, captures, members, time online}] Yeah- could totally go crazy with this. ^_^

Stardouser · 2012-04-21, 01:12 PM

Originally Posted by ringring

There always were people that didn't want to join outfits, that's fine although they're missing a lot, and I mean a lot.

What you seem to be describing (to me) is an outfit that isn't an outfit. What is the purpose of an outfit that is simply a bunch of what would appear to be disorganised people?

A real outfit should have some kind of organisation. The outfit that I beloing to did and we never considered ourselves elite by any means.

Back to the point, I don't see it and I'd prefer development time to be invested elsewhere.

I doubt very much that this would take significant development time. And as with all MMOs, the social aspect is one of the biggest things that keeps people playing, so even if there was some development time to it, it would be worth it. The fact that the outfits might not instantly start running organized maneuvers is not relevant; but the ability to instantly join a social network is.

As for me I'm hoping to be able to start or join a BF3-refugee themed outfit...something with Mordor in the name preferably

Sledgecrushr · 2012-04-21, 02:04 PM

Im pretty sure Deathwatch will never use the outfit autojoin button.

Gonefshn · 2012-04-21, 02:27 PM

Outfit autojoin just sounds awkward to me.

It seems like a feature that is completely unnecessary. If a player wants to join an outfit it will be incredibly easy to do. There were tons of outfits that just let anyone join and/or spammed chat to recruit members in PS1. This will happen in the new game just like it does in every MMO. Joining an outfit is so easy already this just isn't necessary. It's like walking into a room full of people you don't know, "Hey guys... ummmmm hey" it's just weird to me I can't see that working. To me an outfit is all about community with likeminded individuals making a choice to be involved in that community so autojoin is a no for me.