Denial of PTSD Treatment for Soldiers

Neurotoxin · 2012-05-11, 03:04 PM

Hands off Spc. Etterlee and all soldiers with PTSD!

US Military pretty much treats its soldiers like shit and then expects them to die in action or commit suicide. Their procedures are intentionally slow and backwards, they aren't in the business of saving soldiers, both in active duty and for veterans.

How can anyone support a military that doesn't even take care of it's own soldiers? Our military kills more of its own every year than enemy combatants, and lets the survivors live in misery. Suicides, unemployment, homelessness, and lack of care, have gotten completely out of control.

ItsTheSheppy · 2012-05-11, 03:59 PM

I doubt very strongly that the military wants its veterans to kill themselves as a matter of policy or desire. I sincerely doubt there is even a single person in a decision-making capacity who holds those beliefs.

I agree that the system is unfair and broken, but I really have to raise an eyebrow at the idea of there being some sort of evil plot at work.

Baneblade · 2012-05-11, 04:21 PM

It's not policy, it's culture.

**Malorn** · 2012-05-11, 04:51 PM

Mental Illness has always had a long struggle. People have a hard time believing in illnesses that they don't present with clear biological symptoms.

It's easy to dismiss something like that and not call it a real illness or think they can will themselves through it.

Thankfully charities like Wounded Warriors (a noble charity I support) help veterans deal with such challenges.

Neurotoxin · 2012-05-11, 05:26 PM

They don't care about their soldiers. It is more expensive to pay for and care for soldiers, during and after active duty, than to simply let them die when they stop functioning effectively for the military. For the amount of money that is allocated to recruitment, its much cheaper to ship in a new batch of fresh recruits. It's not an evil plot, its a cost-benefit analysis that is ingrained in the culture.

One of the other problems is the fact that military officers aren't really soldiers. Many of them did training in ROTC or a military academy, and get to be an officer without ever understanding what it means to be under heavy direct fire from all directions. Officers routinely send soldiers on missions that are dangerous and pointless errands. When the atrocities of war catch up to a soldier, and they seek care, the officers tell them "suck it up" or something dismissive. Between the lack of access to medical care or even sympathy from leadership, and the suicide rate of over 1 soldier per day, it is hard to say that the problem is actually being addressed in any reasonable way by the military and / or government.

CutterJohn · 2012-05-11, 09:55 PM

I have a solution: Maybe we should stop letting the government air commercials about how awesome it is to be a soldier, or helping out movies as a secondary recruiting technique to ensure they always portray the military in a positive light.

Heck, lets do what they want to do with cigarette boxes.. No colorful advertising of a handsome marine in full dress uniform. Just a corpse, a particularly gory one.

Be all that you can be, in the Army! <Roll picture of corpse>

Originally Posted by Neurotoxin

One of the other problems is the fact that military officers aren't really soldiers.

I always kinda thought the whole officer/enlisted thing was terribly old fashioned. Its a relic of the bygone days of lords and peasants. I don't see why there couldn't just be a unified rank system where everyone starts off as an E-1 and works their way up to whatever their level of competence is. Whats so special about college(especially these days) that lets you bypass 13 or 14 ranks in just 4 years?

For my money, I always greatly preferred prior enlisted officers. Far less likely to care about shit that doesn't matter, and far less likely to spout bullshit.

Noivad · 2012-05-12, 02:31 AM

Originally Posted by Sobekeus

It's not policy, it's culture.

You are correct. It is part of the culture. I went through it. I have PTSD. I'm an 18 year Vetern. Its starts in basic with the words Sick call No Good in many a warriors jody call. When I was in you were discouraged to goto sickcall even if you really had too. It part of the unspoken code of a Warrior that you just don't get sick. Its peer pressure. You don't want to be absent and let your friends down. You depend on each other.

Even today, after being out, I still hate to go on civilian sick call to see a doctor. Your trained to assemble your weapon, even if you only have one hand and cannot see. to go on even when your injured. To give it you all. When you were hurt you took a pill, usually at least 1, typliclly 3 800 mg of Motrin a day. Its where the expression "Take a Pill came from." Thats was always the solution to the problem. When I was waiting for discharge they had me on 26 different pills a day, some of them multiple times a day.

I had "Soft Tissue Injuries, and herniated disks C6/C7, and was still required to particpate as if nothing was wrong with me in all unit activites. I had limited use of my left hand, there was nerve damage and it just did not work all the time. I was so fucked up on meds, I got depressed, cause they were booting me out, hit a wall one day when I was pissed over my situation with my hand, and when the wall did not break really got pissed off, and really tried to break it. The two by 4 studd just would not have it. It won the fight breaking my hand and fingers in serveral places above the wrist. The BN CSM perfered charges against me, and there was an impartial LOD (Line of Duty) Investigation, which cleared me as I was under the influnence of many Drugs prescribed to me by Doctors at Fort Gorden when I had my Anger bout.. Would you believe I went out on an ARTEP at Fort Stewart, with a SF team and a Pric 77 on my back, and a cast on my arm all drugged up.

Discharge from active duty can take anywhere from a year to three depending on your injuries and how long it takes them to discharge you. we had one guy who broke his back, had several operations, where they put steal rods alngside his vertabre. They even gave him Opium for pain managment. He was high all the time. Took 4 years to discharge him, and he tied up a slot, so the unit was short.

Then you get to play the VA Shuffel when you get out, which is not as bad now as it used to be. They actually get to you faster, and getting into the system is only 6 months now. I got a $25,000 severence pay when I got my Medical Discharge. I now pay that back to the VA for the privilage to use it. Another 8 or 9 years and I'll have it paid off. I'm rated at 50% disiblity, DA did not give me anything for my wounds that caused my discharge, I got it for other injuries. I can probally get it to 100% acording to the VFW, but the VA is so short of funds, I want that 50% to go to some other guy who needs it more then me.

When I 1st started going to the VA I, was called back to it after a physical where they took xrays of my chest. I got a adminstrative meeting with two doctors. They informed me that I had less then 3 months to live. Thats was back in 1994 I think - can't remember.
But the VA has gotten better, and my advise to those who really need care from the VA is to go to North East USA as they have more funding available to a seperate veteran, as there are less of them there and money is given out equally to seperate regions. So if you live in a state like Florida that has a very high proportion of vets, there is less money to go around per vet.
And while the VA may be slow, they do provide a service to many that is life saving. The Government System is just not as good as the Private system.

And I do pay for private insurance too, because some of the drugs I take to stay alive, they don't have it in their stock.

About PTSD - My Doberman Pincher helps me with that when I'm out an about. And for some strange reason, it is soothing to me, to kill NC and VS in PS1 as well as other FPS games. I look forward to killing more of you NC and VS scum. Thanks SOE. It would be great if SOE / PS2 got involved in the Wounded Warrior Project, Trace Adkins has.
Just a thought.

https://support.woundedwarriorprojec...FQ0q7Aod2Vs1Tg

But I got to say this. If I had to do the 18 years all over again so you guys could squable about this and that, and take your freedoms for granted, I would. I wanted my daughter, and now my grandson, to have all the opportunities that I had growing up. hoough.

BuzzCutPsycho · 2012-05-14, 04:42 PM

Originally Posted by Noivad

But I got to say this. If I had to do the 18 years all over again so you guys could squable about this and that, and take your freedoms for granted, I would.

Nothing you did was to protect our freedoms. Nothing you did was to my benefit. Nothing you did was for the betterment of the American people. Quit being delusional.

I exercise my freedoms every day and you've done nothing to protect that because it hasn't been threatened since WW2.

I have a solution: Maybe we should stop letting the government air commercials about how awesome it is to be a soldier, or helping out movies as a secondary recruiting technique to ensure they always portray the military in a positive light.

The amount of hero worship people bestow upon our "troops" is utterly disgusting. It's no wonder the military nowadays attracts the young, poor and stupid.

CutterJohn · 2012-05-15, 12:14 AM

Originally Posted by BuzzCutPsycho

The amount of hero worship people bestow upon our "troops" is utterly disgusting. It's no wonder the military nowadays attracts the young, poor and stupid.

Yeah, it was pretty weird for a while. The family was 10000% more proud of me than I found comfortable or appropriate. You'd think I'd cured cancer from they way they acted. All I did was make sure a single propeller continued to turn. That was my life. Keep the prop spinning, no matter what. Frankly it just got pathetic after a while.. I wanted to scream at people that its just a job with a silly uniform and shitty hours.

If I wanted to get laid, all I had to do was wear my uniform back home and I'd have a line. Ok, that part was fun...

I think its telling that we changed the name of Armistice day to Veterans day. We no longer honor peace. We honor the veterans. I reminded dad of that last veterans day when he called me... Never got a response. Oh well.

Surprise · 2012-06-13, 03:13 PM

Cannibus may be an effective treatment for ptsd. Veteran suicides are at an all time high. "The Department of Veterans Affairs estimates 18 veterans die by suicide each day."

ricoxg · 2012-06-13, 05:43 PM

I'm a US Army vet and OP is flat wrong. Not trying to be offensive, buddy, but you really are. For one, the system for getting treatment is made up mostly by Active Duty folks and Vets, and we look out for each other. Sure, there are those few dirt-bags who screw up and get lots of attention, but there are plenty who are out there every day busting their rears to take care of their brothers and sisters in arms. I haven't had the greatest of experiences with the VA, but that's because it's socialized medicine, and nothing ever works once it gets attached to a bureaucracy. Nearly everyone I dealt with at the VA were genuinely good folks who cared about me.

To my brother, Noivad. Dude, that sucks and I'm sorry. I can't say much about what happened when you were in, but I wasn't there and I don't know anything about it. I just know that being a Sergeant was one of the highlights of my life, and taking care of Joes was the ultimate rush. All I can say is that if a Soldier in any of the units I served in ever had the problems you're describing, any of the CSMs or 1SGs I ever served with would have bent over backwards to help you get your crap straight and squared away. You may have just had a deadbeat CSM. It happens, sometimes.

Bottom line is, you served when few would, and you got scars, but you have people around you who honor you for them, and you have a legion of brothers and sisters who you share a bond with that none of the civilians around you will ever understand. Kick that BS anger and take a look around. How can you feel anything other than pride in this family? o7

BuzzCutPsycho · 2012-06-17, 01:48 PM

The answer to PTSD is less drugs and more therapy. Drugs can make it worse.

Warborn · 2012-06-17, 04:31 PM

Originally Posted by elfailo

Won't happen soon. Pharm companies can't make any money on weed because everyone can grow it in their backyards.

You can make gin in your bathtub, but that doesn't mean the gin business is kaput. You set a huge company with virtually unlimited resources to the production of this stuff and you quickly find yourself with a product that is safer and more enjoyable than anything a regular jackoff can produce. If weed were legal, I don't think people would bother growing an inferior product when they could go buy a pack of better weed than they've ever had from the... weed store, wherever it'd be sold.

But anyway, won't happen in the USA in our lifetimes I'd imagine. The public is overwhelmingly in favour of decriminalization in the US, but the government would look like a bunch of stupid motherfuckers if they went and turned a Schedule I drug -- something they've deemed highly addictive and with no medicinal properties, on par with heroin -- into something you could buy legally. Everyone at the DEA and DOJ would look like a bunch of sad fucks for having ruined untold lives over what they'd probably then have classified as equivalent to alcohol. But chances are once we Canadian fucks vote out our shithead Conservative government we'll probably revisit the issue of weed (which we were about to decriminalize anyway) and give y'all a place to come for some drug tourism if you want.

Anyway, yeah, a tangent here. PTSD sucks. Couple people in my regiment had it after coming back from Afghanistan and I think our own governments handling of their troubles was sorely lacking as well.

Neurotoxin · 2012-06-18, 05:25 AM

Therapist can't provide them quality housing, access to medical care, good quality food, access to education, access to art and entertainment, and a good job that pays fairly and equitably. If therapists could do that, 95% of their patients would walk out without drugs and never come back.

As for homemade vs store-bought... maybe I'm biased, but the homebrews my brother and I make are pretty damn good, even compared to high quality microbrews. I'd imagine cannabis grown by Phillip Morris or Monsanto would be very plain and generic, while home-growers will still be able to make a better product. The downside is that the cost of production vs value of the product would plummet, putting most independent growers out of business quickly unless they can justify charging 2005 prices for everything.

I agree that it should be legal, but I understand that the way it gets legalized isn't from thoughtful discussion, but action. Not pro-cannabis protests, but pro-democracy protests, campaigning for a system where people can actually have the power to decide on things which are important to them, in a way that is fair and civil. This would also lead to the public being able to decide if we should prioritize health care for all citizens in need, especially those who have endured something physically and mentally stressful like military service.

And I bet cannabis has a higher approval rating than Obama.

Warborn · 2012-06-18, 01:48 PM

Originally Posted by Neurotoxin

And I bet cannabis has a higher approval rating than Obama.

That snide motherfucker laughed when someone asked about decriminalizing it during his online open house thing. Here's a guy who admitted to smoking marijuana and doing cocaine during highschool/college. What does he figure his chances of being President would have been had he, a young black man, been caught by the police during the first couple decades of the War on Drugs with pot or cocaine? Fucking zero. Not a chance. Barry laughs at the idea of decriminalizing a substance that he's used himself and, had he been unlucky enough to have been caught with, would have made him just another black man with a drug conviction.