Concerns about the F2p model

BoldarBlood · 2012-11-09, 04:49 PM

currently soe is deleting and moderating critical threads about the monetization. i think they know that they broke their promises.

after i read today that they will sell weapons directly for real money, i am very concerned. for me it is clearly pay 2 win (also by wikipedia definition) to give out gameplay relevant advantages for real cash. sure, you can get it also by playing, but that will take time and till then you have to play against people who just bought their weapons like a a2a missle pod.

the whole system is clearly designed to drive up the frustration so that the players sink tons of money in the shop instead of giving good motivations and creating a good gameexperience by a balanced levelsystem, like you would get it in a fullprice game.

what bugs me too with selling weapons directly is the question what happens in the future? a constant flow of new weapons which are needed to keep your chances up?

Sturmhardt · 2012-11-09, 05:03 PM

Originally Posted by BoldarBlood

what bugs me too with selling weapons directly is the question what happens in the future? a constant flow of new weapons which are needed to keep your chances up?

This is the only point of all you mentioned that concerns me.
I have no problem that they are selling the weapons for cash if you can acquire them by playing too (if you are not playing 6 months for 1 weapon). We always knew this was happening and I always understood it because someone has to pay the bills.

But if they keep adding new weapons every month they will screw up the balance eventually. I hope they won't.

BoldarBlood · 2012-11-09, 05:09 PM

Originally Posted by Sturmhardt

This is the only point of all you mentioned that concerns me.
I have no problem that they are selling the weapons for cash if you can acquire them by playing too (if you are not playing 6 months for 1 weapon). We always knew this was happening and I always understood it because someone has to pay the bills.

But if they keep adding new weapons every month they will screw up the balance eventually. I hope they won't.

like in every other f2p game they have to add more and more stuff to the shop to keep the revenue up.

sylphaen · 2012-11-09, 05:12 PM

Even if I prefer a subscription system, I do not think SOE broke their promises. They never promised a free game. You pay with playtime or you pay with money.

You have access to all certs:
- Play a lot and you can unlock.
- Pay a lot and you can unlock.

Consider all the other games that sell you DLC and expansions: it's the same thing.

I do however understand your frustration. I also feel that it is much easier to feel frustration and unease with F2P than other models.

If it may help you, consider PS2 as a subscription game that allows a portion of their players to participate for free; of course, they get less benefits.

And if you REALLY feel angry at SOE, do not pay for anything and play for free. If their game is still fun to play, then F2P for PS2 works (you spend time in the game and provide challenge to other players, you are compensated with the opportunity to play the game). If it's not fun, you will naturally stop to play.

EVILPIG · 2012-11-09, 05:18 PM

I don't know why we need a new thread, but I disagree with the OP. I don't consider the current model P2W at all. Everything can also be earned in game. All of this has been known for some time.

Offer a cash only overpowered weapon and then we'll talk about P2W.

BoldarBlood · 2012-11-09, 05:18 PM

Originally Posted by sylphaen

If it may help you, consider PS2 as a subscription game that allows a portion of their players to participate for free; of course, they get less benefits.

i would rather pay for a subscription than getting a less quallity gameplay experience for free. the grind is pretty hard and if you buy the stuff in the shop, than you would pay far more than with a subscription.

Tooterfish · 2012-11-09, 05:25 PM

Planetside 2 has a lot more to offer. There is popular content still missing from Planetside 1 that players are asking for that I assume are deliberately being delayed for future content patches. You only need to take a look at the ideas forum to see that, clearly, there is a limitless array of items, content and features that can be implemented later to accommodate paying players, and insure the survival of the game.

I understand F2P players are worried, and as a paying player I also don't want to be given advantages. I think Planetside 2 reaches to make us all feel like we're in a communal struggle on the battlefield. Nothing distracts me and removes me from that communal sensation more than being given more power, not to mention the double-standard that would create for what is considered a "skill-based shooter".

xuur · 2012-11-09, 05:45 PM

well said

SturmovikDrakon · 2012-11-09, 05:46 PM

Pay 2 win would imply you wouldn't be able to buy weapons through in-game means but cash only

Except this is not the case

Your three threads were closed because people were giving you multiple examples of how this is not P2W and yet you continued acting like a moron and ignoring every valid point made

Mox · 2012-11-09, 06:02 PM

F2p is always p2w! Accept it. the only no go is to sell items that give advantage and cant be earned by playing.

sylphaen · 2012-11-09, 06:28 PM

Originally Posted by BoldarBlood

i would rather pay for a subscription than getting a less quallity gameplay experience for free. the grind is pretty hard and if you buy the stuff in the shop, than you would pay far more than with a subscription.

If you would rather pay for a subscription, then choose to do so ! Why so angry about letting people play for free...

I loved PS1, I subscribed to that game for years.
I'm still not sold 100% for PS2 but I have high hopes for that game. I may decide to buy alpha squad (or not) and just play for free until I feel better about the game.

Most people will likely choose to play for free and pay items as they go or unlock them.

Do you really expect SOE to run without money ? Would you work for no salary ? People who pay for the game (with money) also pay for the free players (who give their time).

No one wants a game that will only be fun for paying players. No one wants P2W because even in the paying crowd, some have more affordable income than others. We want a fun game for everyone and a lot of players. However, someone has to pay for the servers, developers, taxes...

Stop thinking anything is free, you will feel better. As a matter of fact, just stop thinking about money and judge the game through FUN. Give PS2 a try and see if you have fun with your time. There is no reason not to play if you are having fun with the game. Similarly, if the game is not fun, even paying players will stop playing.

Change your mindset and you will enjoy more things.

Tooterfish · 2012-11-09, 06:38 PM

Originally Posted by Mox

F2p is always p2w!

This statement isn't true.

Beerbeer · 2012-11-09, 06:59 PM

I like their model, at least insofar as much as I understand it.

I'm not sure if I'll get the membership to see how quickly I can get the certs I want or just buy the stuff I feel I need right away to reach the style of play that I enjoy. Maybe I'll do both, but I need a good, real baseline to see how it all falls inline.

But yeah, for those with a lot of patience, you can get stuff that impatient people like myself might get right away. However, I actually really don't mind the grind, but there's some things that I'll probably want right away to make the rest if the grind more enjoyable.

To each their own, though.

SixShooter · 2012-11-09, 09:21 PM

Originally Posted by BoldarBlood

currently soe is deleting and moderating critical threads about the monetization. i think they know that they broke their promises.

after i read today that they will sell weapons directly for real money, i am very concerned. for me it is clearly pay 2 win (also by wikipedia definition) to give out gameplay relevant advantages for real cash. sure, you can get it also by playing, but that will take time and till then you have to play against people who just bought their weapons like a a2a missle pod.

the whole system is clearly designed to drive up the frustration so that the players sink tons of money in the shop instead of giving good motivations and creating a good gameexperience by a balanced levelsystem, like you would get it in a fullprice game.

what bugs me too with selling weapons directly is the question what happens in the future? a constant flow of new weapons which are needed to keep your chances up?

Holy shit! That is some crazy breaking news. Oh wait, it's totally not.

The rate at which XP is earned, thus earning cert points, seems fairly generous and not at all frustrating. WOT and T:A felt very frustrating for me in that regard but I haven't felt that frustration in PS2. I think it's a good model and I hope it works out well for them since I plan on playing for a long time.

SFJake · 2012-11-10, 12:25 PM

Any F2P model that isn't a 100% free besides cosmetic exists against the costumers and not for it.

It'll always be a joke, and paying for this is a disgrace. They ARE going to be nickel and dimming people with overpriced **** instead of just letting you pay an appropriate one-time fee to properly enjoy a game.

As long as people think this kind of shit is acceptable, gaming will be shit. For god's sakes, stop ruining every FPS in existence with F2P garbage. F2P IS ANTI-CONSUMER DAMNIT.