Infantry Combat

SeraphC · 2012-12-17, 08:30 AM

1)When I leave my vehicle behind and get into close or medium range combat I usually end up dead. Often I hardly damage my opponent. Here are some problems I've been having:

-Getting flanked:
This game has very limited methods of letting you know where your enemies are. So when I enter a room I often don't know whether or not a hostile will be in there. On top of that all rooms have multiple entrances/cover places. A fight seems to last about 1.5 seconds on average, which doesn't exactly leave you any time to clear all entrances/corners/... in a room.
Any advice on how to improve my situational awareness?

-Not getting my fire on the target:
Often when I get the drop on a target I still don't manage to get the kill. Guns seem to shoot all over the place except where you point them. The recoil on the guns is terrible as well.
I play NC. From what I've read/seen this may be a problem unique to that faction. If so, does it get solved by getting the grip certification for your guns?
Any other advice?

I don't have any first person shooter experience and a lot of my failings can probably be attributed to that, so keep it in mind while answering.

2) Side question: why do snipers of different factions carry different amounts of ammo? Most (at least 70%) of my kills with Infiltrators are head shots. Even at very long range it doesn't seem that hard to land them. They are a one hit kill, so what justifies only giving an NC infiltrator half the ammo carried compared to a TR one?

Mooseay · 2012-12-17, 08:41 AM

on the sniper question it has to do with the design philosophy of each empire the TR have quick firing guns which as you'd imagine burn through ammo in a flash. The NC have hard hitting slow shooting weapons so what might take you 1 shot to kill it might take other empires 2. The NC don't need a follow up shot so they don't need extra bullets.

Mooseay · 2012-12-17, 08:49 AM

with the flanking problem I might advise tho be aware of where the enemy are spawning from co-ordinated outfits might flank but the zerg wil just charge right at you.

apart from that sick close to team mates don't sprint into a firefight and know where the border is between your team and the enemy. you end up being able to anticipate where the'll come from with time and not trying to cover every door.

ShadetheDruid · 2012-12-17, 09:18 AM

Something that I found helped me with the flanking issue (not that I did it intentionally, it's just how I play) is to play sneaky for a while. Find all the good hiding spots and test them out, try out different corners in different buildings to see how they benefit you when people come in a room, that sort of thing.

Just from doing that, I know a lot of the good hiding spots in places and it just became second nature for me to quickly check those places when entering a room. Other than that, always keep watching every point an attack might come from, and never stop moving (unless you're sure you aren't going to get sniped or surprised).

On sniper rifles: The only one shot kill (headshots) rifles are the bolt actions. Only NC starts with one, but all factions can unlock them. The default sniper rifles for VS and TR are semi auto and do less damage.

NC weapons: Yeah, NC weapons are a pain to use, at least the stock ones (except maybe the medic's Gauss Rifle, that's not too bad). Which class are you using most? If you're using HA and having trouble with the Gauss SAW (which I wouldn't be surprised if you don't have much FPS experience), then i'd advise saving for a new weapon.

The GD-22S I think is the cheapest, it's only 100 certs (that's what I use). But whatever you're using, especially if you pick up the GD-22S for the heavy, get the forward grip attachment. That will reduce (or even almost negate in some cases, like the GD-22S) horizontal recoil a lot and means you'll only have to deal with vertical.

You're still going to have to deal with the horrible cone of fire, but some of the other weapons you can get are a lot less spray-ey. If you need to take out a target who isn't going to shoot back (or at least right away), burst fire rather than full auto.

Juryrig · 2012-12-17, 10:20 AM

Good points from the others, I'll try to add a couple of things I've picked up as well.

Originally Posted by SeraphC

Getting flanked:
This game has very limited methods of letting you know where your enemies are. So when I enter a room I often don't know whether or not a hostile will be in there. On top of that all rooms have multiple entrances/cover places. A fight seems to last about 1.5 seconds on average, which doesn't exactly leave you any time to clear all entrances/corners/... in a room.
Any advice on how to improve my situational awareness?

Only ever run when you're either (a) sure there's no-one in the spot you're running into that's going to shoot you or (b) you're in open ground and need to keep running because you ARE getting shot at.

Run to cover, then look around (constantly check for people being behind you) and then advance more slowly, ready to fire - don't run into a room and then expect to be able to react when you find there's 3 enemies already in there! I died so many times because of trying to run to where I thought the fight was, instead of checking that it wasn't just right there in front of me.

Also, let others go first, and see if they get shot/shot at. Get used to looking for where they are getting shot from; and remember to check the tops of buildings etc. Light assault in particular will use ledges and rooftops etc. I've lost count of the number of times I've stood on the landing pad at the dome bases shooting at the enemies on the roof who have been happily sniping the defenders on the pad itself.

Sometimes you just have to head into a room, point your gun straight into a corner....and find that the bad guy is in the other corner. Next time, you try the other corner first, and eventually (at least sometimes) you end up getting the drop on people. There's something very satisfactory about emptying a full clip into someone's back, from point blank range, knowing they didn't even realise you were behind them

It does come with practice and just spending time thinking about what you are doing.

-Not getting my fire on the target:
Often when I get the drop on a target I still don't manage to get the kill. Guns seem to shoot all over the place except where you point them. The recoil on the guns is terrible as well.
I play NC. From what I've read/seen this may be a problem unique to that faction. If so, does it get solved by getting the grip certification for your guns?

I would be pilloried for saying "play Vanu" even though that's what I did after getting an NC to BR 11 and finding it more frustrating than fun.

Try the following....

- aim down the sights as much as possible
- cert a reflex sight, or use one of the zooms (3.4 or 4x) and 'snipe' from a medium distance
- cert the lasersight, preferably the improved laser sight. That'll improve your accuracy whilst hip-firing, whereas you can control accuracy when aiming down the sights pretty well anyway.
- If you come face to face with someone, run towards them whilst firing. Closing the distance can help you stay accurate, and often seems to throw people. You'll then die to their mates, but at least you feel like you achieved something by getting the kill
- Burst fire
- Play one class/weapon consistently so you get used to the recoil/cone of fire, and find 'what works' rather than chopping and changing and being frustrated
- keep working at it, it does get better

I don't have any first person shooter experience and a lot of my failings can probably be attributed to that, so keep it in mind while answering.

This was also my situation, and is reflected in the fact that the stats in my sig are significantly poorer than those in others you'll see. I'm getting better, though, and as it gets better it's becoming (even) more fun, so, stick at it.

2) Side question: why do snipers of different factions carry different amounts of ammo? Most (at least 70%) of my kills with Infiltrators are head shots. Even at very long range it doesn't seem that hard to land them. They are a one hit kill, so what justifies only giving an NC infiltrator half the ammo carried compared to a TR one?

What they said. NC start with a bolt-action, and all bolt actions have less ammo (I think - could be wrong though).

I just recently bought a bolt-action for my Vanu, and at range even though I'm getting the cross-in-a-circle indicator to say I hit a headshot, it isn't killing people. Boo.

belch · 2012-12-17, 12:09 PM

I am by no means a 'leet' player, but some things stood out to me in your post.

For starters, you didn't mention coordinating with anyone else before entering a room that you expected to make contact in. While it may be necessary to clear a structure single handedly, it is definitely not a preferred technique. Learning the layout of structures is helpful...but there are still just too many areas to properly clear by yourself. If you do have to make entry into a spot like that alone, you definitely have to take your time, pie off corners/openings...and fully expect to take not more than 1-2 of them with you before getting riddled with bullets/laser beams/rockets/grenades.

You also mention recoil being a huge factor (as well it should be). Of course, you can cert into your preferred weapon to reduce the effects of recoil, but like you've noted...certain factions are at a disadvantage...especially in close quarters. I have noticed that the VS have a distinct advantage in the lack of 'muzzle jump' in pretty much all one on one confrontations I have had with them. At any rate, one thing that may help, is starting lower than center mass (more in the groin) and allwoing the excessive recoil to do some work for you by sending the next 2 rounds further up the torso (chest and head).

LoliLoveFart · 2012-12-17, 03:59 PM

Knowing if an enemy will be in a room is an expereince thing, knowing the layout of the facility really helps and if you are sitting on points and getting flanked, footsteps are really easily heard even over gunfire so listen out for them. If you are unaware if there is an enemy in the room and no friendlies have charged in lob in a grenade or put a few rounds through the door, if that doesn't rustle something up venture in.

Inside the room you are gona wana stick to the walls, if someone does come in and suprises you, start firing at their chest and crouch while you are croucing push you reticule up to their head, fight should be over fairly quickly. If you suprise them, adadadad. The art of ad'ing is moving side to side to throw their aim off while keeping yours on them. It does take a little bit of practice but once you nail it you should be winning most fights against equally or less skilled oponents.

One thing you are going to want to do as NC is avoid full auto, 2-3 shot bursts at medium range will keep the recoil manageable. Only go full auto at close range even then be mindful of recoil bloom. NCs biggest problem is recoil bloom, that is where the COF increases the longer you fire, the recoil bloom in ps2 is interesting, as in as soon as you stop firing it goes back to 0, abuse this knowledge when you burst fire.

ShadetheDruid · 2012-12-17, 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by LoliLoveFart

Inside the room you are gona wana stick to the walls, if someone does come in and suprises you, start firing at their chest and crouch while you are croucing push you reticule up to their head, fight should be over fairly quickly.

I'd say be careful trying this, from personal experience (both on the giving and receiving ends), crouching in close combat makes you easier to headshot if the person shooting at you has faster reactions (since your head is then where people tend to aim, and you can aim down on people at their blobby mass instead of just a small blob on top).

Palerion · 2012-12-17, 04:44 PM

I do find there to be a large imbalance between factions, which is quite disappointing as when I choose a faction, I would usually prefer my choice to be based on the fact that I like how they look, not how powerful they are. Honestly though, I would not switch to another faction because NC is underpowered, as I'm assuming (hoping) they will buff the TR and NC to the VS's level. I have noticed that in comparison to the TR after the latest TR nerfs, NC seems reasonable. I think it would be logical for SOE to buff the NC and TR to the level of power that the VS has, as the Vanu feel like their kills are clean, and much less annoying to get than that of the TR and NC. Wonder how many times I said TR, NC, and VS in this post...

Moodel · 2012-12-18, 09:11 AM

Originally Posted by SeraphC

1)This game has very limited methods of letting you know where your enemies are. So when I enter a room I often don't know whether or not a hostile will be in there. On top of that all rooms have multiple entrances/cover places. A fight seems to last about 1.5 seconds on average, which doesn't exactly leave you any time to clear all entrances/corners/... in a room.
Any advice on how to improve my situational awareness?

Always look up and remember angles, angles, angles. And keep trying

Xenics · 2012-12-19, 08:08 AM

As a fellow NC who has also just started acclimating to the game, here are a few tips that have worked well for me, in this game and others.

1. Don't rush. This is VERY important in PS2, where most weapons can rip through your health in 1-2 seconds. The default run speed is also so slow it's hugely difficult not to mash the sprint key everywhere you go, but this puts you at a severe disadvantage once you make contact with the enemy. And you will.

2. Be evasive. Whenever I suspect an enemy might be hiding out somewhere, like in a corner, I just take a quick glance. If I spot someone, I don't engage them, but retreat and find another approach. I might double back, or I might not, but the real purpose is to unnerve them. Once your enemy realizes you're not coming back right away, they'll start to get nervous and most likely come out of hiding, which puts you on more even footing.

3. Give yourself time to think. It's important to have good situational awareness at all times. Know where your closest allies are, where the nearest friendly base is, where the nearest enemy base is, etc. You can never be sure where an enemy might attack from, but if there's a horde of NC vehicles to your east and a TR outpost to your west, you've got a pretty good idea of which flank you need to be checking the most.