Gameplay: Walker Vehicles (Not BFRs)

MrMak · 2013-04-01, 08:03 PM

I was thinking on what role a BFR would play if it were to be reintorduced and properly balanced. Then i thought that a vehicle using legs to move about would have to logicaly be rather slow compared to tracked and wheeled ones but able to traverse much more difficult terrain.

Then i tohught that instead of BFRs add smaller walkers that would be too slow to traverse long distances but would be able to climb terrain ven infantry would have issues (of course within reason).

There would be 3 types. The Light Walker, the Heavy walker and the Transport Walker.

The Light Walker: This one would only be piloted by one person and would be relatively cheap (thinking 100ish mechanised resources). It would be fast enaugh to somewhat keep up with slower vehicles, such as stock vanguards for short ditsances and woudl have the best climbing abilities. They would be highly resistant to small arms but not completly immune and a single stock launcher rocket would set it on fire, while a decimator or phoenix would 1 hit kill it. It would have the same weapon options as a Flash, so it owuld start with a basilisk and have the option to swap it to a Kobalt, Fury or the new flash shotgun.

It woudl be also able to crouch behind cover but when doing so it would only be able to aim in a narrow angle in fornt. It would tak a few ceonds for it to get bakc up on its feet. It would also automaticaly croutch when the driver leaves.

Its primary role would be to provide close fire support to infantry Due to its size and climbing abilities it would be able to get to a lot of places other vehicles except maybe Flashes are unable to reach (not inside normal buildings though, it would be too tall for that.

Essentialy something like an AT-PT: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/All_T...onal_Transport

Heavy Walker:

This would be a bit closer to a BFR but still significantly weaker and smaller. In apearance they would be close to the EU Walkers form Battlefield 2142 with the drivr havign 2 guns on the sides and the gunner a secondary turret on the top: http://battlefield.wikia.com/wiki/L5_Riesig

It would have the aproximate armor and overall firepower of a lightning but it would be barely any faster than sprinting infantry. Irs primary purpouse would be to get heavier firepower across rough terrain or into positions unavaliable to tanks. On open ground Lightnings and MBTs would make short work of them.

The weapons would consist of a secondary gun on the top as previously mentioned, with the same options as the trrets on a Sunderer while the driver would get 2 primary weapons which would be controled and installed individualy like MAX weapons.

These walkers would preferably be empire specific with a more diverse weapons selection and diferences than the MBTs and Fighters.

For instance. The TR Walker woudl be a bit faster and would have a sprinting ability similar to the MAX charge whchich would temorarely sacrafice it's hil lclimbingability for a short burst of speed. The default primary weapons would be heavy armor piercing chainguns effective against both infantry and vehicles (but balanced so 2 of these arent more effective agianst vehicles than thel ightning's default gun) with the option to swap to specialised Anti Tank or Anti Infantry rocket pods.

The NC walker would apear as say a modifided heavy power loader. It woudl be the slowest but it would also have the best armor. It's default weapons would be 2 autocannons with the option to swap then for single shot AP or HE (this HE would do barely any damage to vehicles and the blast wouldnt bem uch larger than a tank's HEAT round) guns. The Special ability would either be a straight up copy of the vanguard shield or a larger version of the heavy Assault's Nanite Mesh Generator.

The VS walker would have a more alien design. It would walk operhaps on 4 legs (somewhat like the AT-AA: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/All_T..._Anti-Aircraft), allowing it to strafe and giving it clmbing abilities comparable to light walkers. The primary weapons would be a pair of energy weapons similar to PPAs whit the option to swap to chargable energy weapons similar to the lancer. One woudl be AT (not wuite acuate enaugh to snipe infantry from far away) and the other would be anti infantry with a small blast radious, perhaps leaving a small damaging plasma cloud for a few seconds on ful lcharge much like the plasma canon which i believe was mounted on one of the NC BFR's in PS1.

Not sure about the special ability though.

Hovering would be reduntant or too similar to the TR walker's sprint. Jumping could lead to some horrid exploits. the only other thing i came up wih was to leet it "detatch" the secondary gun as a small scout walker or other unarmored vehicle or perhaps have the secondary gun fold or deconsruct and haviong the 4 leged walker split into 2 lighter 2 leged ones with the driver and gunner controling each and using one of the 2 main weapons. but that could be too complex.

Transport Walker.

This would be a slow lightly armed ( 1 secondary turret with sunderer weapon options) medium armored 4 or even six leged vehicle who'se only purpouse would be to transport infantry up slopes to difficult for them to climb on foot. In apearance im thinking something like the AT-OT: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/All_T...Open_Transport but bo biger than a sunderer..

Walker Transporter.

Walkers would be a pain to get from place to blace due to their low speed. Especialy Heavy and Transport walkers which would require MBT level vehicle terminals. So a means to get them fom battle to battle would be required. This role would be fileld by an un armed upen top truck, perhaps based around the general design of the sunderer, especialy the front. These transports would have 4 "slots" each with likght walkers taking 1, havy walkers taking 2 and transport wlakers taking all 4. The walkers would of course be unable to do anything, especialy fire until lthey get unloaded, they woudl jsut remain in "crouched" mode untill the transpord deploys to let them walk off. The truck itself would be partcularly unwieldy due to i's size and weight but it would be fast enaugh on relatively flat terrain to make it worthwhile to use.

Whiteagle · 2013-04-02, 04:58 AM

My own thoughts on the Subject...

Originally Posted by MrMak

The Light Walker:

This is actually a good idea, a light, Sentinel-style, NS Scout Walker for hilly terrain like Amerish.
Too tall to go inside like Flashes and Infantry can, it's crouch still allows it to fire into doors and windows.

Originally Posted by MrMak

Heavy Walker:

...This however is the category where our opinions differ...

You see, my idea for this weight class was to bring back the BFR, but as the ABFR or Amphibious Battle Frame Robot.
It would sort of be like a Lightning/ESF hybrid, a one man vehicle with an option for two weapon systems, but their specific battlefield niche is one that won't be available unless we get Intercontinental Oceans to travel...

...Because the Terran and NC ABFRs transform into Submarines.

These would be the type of armor you'd use for establishing a Continental Beach-head, able to not only make landfall but continue to support troops as they move up the shore.

The Terran model is sleek looking, faster then the NC's version in both theaters, but still only able to move as fast as a walking Infantryman while on land.
It's default weapons are a couple of chain-guns as well as two rocket pods which fire in a high arc.

The NC have an armored tub, slowest on land and only marginally faster on water then its Vanu counterpart, but the heaviest armored of all three.
Its weapons are all slow firing, a Rail Cannon great for sniping other Vehicles (or VERY unlucky Infantry) as well as a high-powered Depth Charge that launches with a much faster but shallower arc then the TR ABFR Rocket Pods.

...The Vanu BFR is the only one that doesn't follow this trend, being what is basically an overgrown MAX Suit that acts like a Hover Lightning.
Since the Magrider can supposedly already hover over bodies of water, my thinking is that the Vanu's focus on hover technology sort of gives them a factional strength when it comes to above water combat and weakness in submersible warfare.
Thus their BFR is a Gundam Humanoid Battle suit that wields Lightning Cannon-equivalent guns like rifles, can throw an Anti-Vehicle Grenade or two, and hovers around like a Magrider.
On land it'd be the fastest of the BFRs, but since it maintains the same speed regardless of terrain the other two are faster as boats.

Originally Posted by MrMak

Transport Walker.

Honestly, I don't think there is much of a roll for a Walker that can carry passengers...
I mean, a Galaxy is always going to be the better option for transporting troops over difficult terrain with its FAR greater speed, while a slow walker full of troops is just begging to get blown up.

I think there is a Land Combat niche though that hasn't been filled, the Bridging Vehicle!

Basically, it'd be a bridge with robot legs, long enough to easily reach an end of itself over small canyons without fear of tipping over.
Once it position, the driver deploys and the whole contraption pretty much lies down on its belly.
The best part however is if you manage to stick it at an angle, you've basically built yourself a ramp that can then be used to jump over walls!

Originally Posted by MrMak

Walker Transporter.

Eh, I don't think you'd need a dedicated Vehicle for this, especially if we get a Heavy Vehicle Transport like the Loadstar from the Original Planetside.
Then you could probably load up everything up to the Bridging Walker, which is probably going to be longer then some ACTUAL bridges in the game.

SGOniell · 2013-04-02, 02:56 PM

Originally Posted by Whiteagle

My own thoughts on the Subject...

This is actually a good idea, a light, Sentinel-style, NS Scout Walker for hilly terrain like Amerish.
Too tall to go inside like Flashes and Infantry can, it's crouch still allows it to fire into doors and windows.

A fellow imperial guard player?

Sentinel like is a fair idea, don't like the rest.

MrMak · 2013-04-02, 08:18 PM

Yeah maybe i overthought the whole thing. Yeah a sentinel like walker would be suficient. Give it a bit more armor and firepower than the Light walker and were set. Perhaps a single variant of the weapons i described for the Heavy walkers. Woudl start out with an autocannon which would be a bit more powerful lthan the basilisk and would be able to swap to an anti infantry getling gun, a single shot 75mm AP gun or a 4 shot Anti infantry rocket launcher.

Whiteagle · 2013-04-03, 01:32 AM

Originally Posted by SGOniell

A fellow imperial guard player?

Nah, just a Mecha Combat aficionado...

Originally Posted by SGOniell

Sentinel like is a fair idea, don't like the rest.

...Uh, which ones and why don't you like them?

I'll admit heavy Combat Walkers don't have a place in Planetside 2 currently, simply because a convential land vehicle would serve as a better weapon's platform, but that's why I envisioned Amphibious BFRs.
Two of them would pretty much be Combat Submarines that could go ashore, put down their legs, and rise up out of the Ocean like Godzilla to support Beach-head Operations or Covert Marine Insertions.
...The Vanu one is just the Hover Lightning they keep asking for in oversized MAX form.

As for a Bridging Vehicle, it could have any type of propultion really, but I figured legs would give it an excuse for why its far end is able to anchor itself on the other end of a canyon.

Originally Posted by MrMak

Yeah maybe i overthought the whole thing. Yeah a sentinel like walker would be suficient. Give it a bit more armor and firepower than the Light walker and were set. Perhaps a single variant of the weapons i described for the Heavy walkers. Woudl start out with an autocannon which would be a bit more powerful lthan the basilisk and would be able to swap to an anti infantry getling gun, a single shot 75mm AP gun or a 4 shot Anti infantry rocket launcher.

No no no man, you're not getting it...
Think less an Armored Combat Platform and more a Flash with Legs, like the AT-RT.

The difference being that, while slight more expensive and slower then its four-wheeled counterpart, it has better handling and hill climbing ability plus it comes armed with a Basilisk by default.

It's one story height would also give the operator much better visibility, but that's a double edged sword...

Baneblade · 2013-04-03, 06:03 PM

Has to be able to grab and throw infantry before it gets my support.

SGOniell · 2013-04-04, 07:23 PM

Originally Posted by Whiteagle

...Uh, which ones and why don't you like them?

Pretty much any of them except for a light walker. As you mentioned, conventional land vehicles fulfill certain roles better. It may not necessarily always be better, but to me anyway, conventional land vehicles are preferred. I simply like tanks.

I personally envision multi occupancy heavy tanks. Costing a ton of resources, and having dedicated gunners, driver, and maybe troop capacity. I should really work on some sketches and post them at some point...

Whiteagle · 2013-04-04, 08:19 PM

Originally Posted by SGOniell

Pretty much any of them except for a light walker. As you mentioned, conventional land vehicles fulfill certain roles better. It may not necessarily always be better, but to me anyway, conventional land vehicles are preferred. I simply like tanks.

Indeed, that's why two of my ABFR concepts are actually just Submarines that can climb on to land, while the third is little more then a Hover-Craft Lightning.

The Bridging Vehicle I feel would work better with legs though, just so it could climb a bit and possibly be used as a ramp.

Originally Posted by SGOniell

I personally envision multi occupancy heavy tanks. Costing a ton of resources, and having dedicated gunners, driver, and maybe troop capacity. I should really work on some sketches and post them at some point...

...Why make it just a Tank?
They could be all out Land Battleships, practically mobile gun bases in and of themselves!

SGOniell · 2013-04-05, 11:47 AM

Originally Posted by Whiteagle

...Why make it just a Tank?
They could be all out Land Battleships, practically mobile gun bases in and of themselves!

Well, a tank is any armored fighting vehicle designed for front-line combat which combines operational mobility with tactical offensive and defensive capabilities. So a "land battleship" would still just be a tank.

I think perhaps the scale of a battleship is way too large for most of the terrain, and linking oceans would cause a lot of stress on servers and players machines.

This guy is about what I'd do, though make it 30%-40% smaller so it can have some maneuverability. Also, covered bridges, gates into amp stations and other outposts like split peak pass would be an issue for something that big.

Whiteagle · 2013-04-05, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by SGOniell

I think perhaps... and linking oceans would cause a lot of stress on servers and players machines.

Yes, I'm well aware of the problems interlinking oceans would cause, which is why I'd personally divide each shore on the Continent's cardinal direction into their own little sub-continental maps, each section of ocean into its own continent-like map, and finally use a similar system to whatever they'll implement at the Warpgates to transfer vehicles and players that cross the boarders.

Originally Posted by SGOniell

This guy is about what I'd do, though make it 30%-40% smaller so it can have some maneuverability. Also, covered bridges, gates into amp stations and other outposts like split peak pass would be an issue for something that big.

That's about what I was thinking as well; just big enough that you could drive a tank or Sunderer inside for field repairs.

Actually being too tall to maneuver through some things might actually be a balancing factor...
If you know the enemy has one of these in their force, then you'll know the can only get it through such and such a pass and can prepare that chokepoint accordingly.

SGOniell · 2013-04-05, 09:03 PM

I could for something like that then. I would also like to see heavy or super heavy tanks with multiple occupancy role though.

Hyncharas · 2013-04-06, 03:16 AM

I'm on the fence mostly about walkers after the BFRs; I think it would be great if there was a Roadmap concept to get opinions from the general community, or an AGN roundtable, as everybody has their own PS2 fansite they go to for news and not everyone will come here to discuss ideas.

Dougnifico · 2013-04-08, 05:17 AM

+1 to light walkers. I think they would make a wonderful addition and could be BFR's done right. Separate driver/gunner heavy tanks are a big win. It keeps the MBT how it is and gives the old guard what they want as well.

SOE, for the love of god, every vehicle from here on out needs to be empire specific. Take your time. Don't rush any NS crap.

Whiteagle · 2013-04-08, 03:45 PM

Originally Posted by Dougnifico

+1 to light walkers. I think they would make a wonderful addition and could be BFR's done right.

No, they're not BFRs at all, more like a Flash that isn't as nasuating to drive off-road in first person...

BFRs should be more like a Lightning or an ESF, a light armored one-man Attack Vehicle that operates mostly in its own theater.
Hence why I think they should pretty much be Watercraft that can go onto land.

Originally Posted by Dougnifico

Separate driver/gunner heavy tanks are a big win. It keeps the MBT how it is and gives the old guard what they want as well.

Dude, I was never old guard and I still want separate Drivers and Main Gunners on MBTs, mostly to keep my poor Lightning from becoming even more redundant.

When I say "Land-Battleship" I mean it; 2-3 Cannon Turrets mounted on a hull at least the size of a diesel-electric locomotive.
More Dakka for Less Driving, how does that sound?