News: Linda Carlson on Community and Offensive Players

[Hamma]

http://www.planetside-universe.com/n...ayers-3071.htm

[EvilNinjadude]

I just wanna mention that there have been both reports and actual recorded instances of people being wrongfully banned. They may be a 0.05% of the 0.05%, but they're there, sometimes they're actual good members of the community, and then they get banned out of the blue. If nobody knows them, there's no chance they're getting the account back. There is no proper way to appeal.

And while there's people we all want gone from the game, like cheaters, hackers, or exploiters, they gotta make sure they don't accidentally ban the wrong person with no way to undo it - Or even worse, no way for them to show that they have been wronged in the first place.

Just wanted to say this. Peace.

[EVILPIG]

The positive: Making the community aware that social status will not save you.

The negative: Publicly saying that the FPS players are basically allowed to misbehave more.

Was it her intention to say that? I do not know, but that is what I get from it. If it is such a policy to view FPS players in such a way, it should be a private policy.

Either way, I appreciate the message of intolerance for exploiters.

[o Solei o]

Originally Posted by EVILPIG

The negative: Publicly saying that the FPS players are basically allowed to misbehave more.

Was it her intention to say that? I do not know, but that is what I get from it. If it is such a policy to view FPS players in such a way, it should be a private policy.

Either way, I appreciate the message of intolerance for exploiters.

They do have to come out and say it otherwise players in other games (such as their upcoming EQ titles) will point to the standard of behavior in the shooters they own (PS titles) as justification for behaving the way they do. They have to be clear that each genre has its own standards, and I'm reasonably certain that anyone who has played FPS games for any period of time is well aware of how much more of a cesspool FPS communities tend to be.

Case in point: In slightly cartoony MMOs like the EQ franchise, encountering someone playing the game with their kids is not that uncommon. However, the other night I encountered a dad trying to teach his ~10 year old daughter how to play. As is often the case with new players, there was some confusion as to whether or not they were talking in local voip or squad voip. The disgusting amount of trolls that came out of the woodwork with less than a dozen people in the entire WG was astounding. It's a sad state of affairs, but if they were to not be more lenient with the standards of conduct in FPS games, they'd wind up banning a rather sizable amount of the community.

[Kalee J]

Originally Posted by EVILPIG

The negative: Publicly saying that the FPS players are basically allowed to misbehave more.

I disagree with you here, EvilPig. I read this and got an entirely different message. I think she simply stated that we as FPS gamers are simply competitive by nature. As such we need to be handled by a different set of standards than in cooperative games like most MMORPGs.

[Neurotoxin]

QUOTE: When I first started playing in 1999, it was the most extraordinarily, overtly sexist environment ever," she says when we meet after her talk. "That's one of the reasons I started playing as a male dwarf. I made a female wood-elf, and it was, 'Hey baby, nice rack!' So I made a female human - not as attractive - and it was still just people wanting to cyber. I finally went for a male dwarf, because nobody wants to touch that."

Then below the following paragraph, two sexy near-naked female warriors. In 14 years, boobs have only gotten more detailed and emphasized. If there was supposed to be a transition to make female characters and players feel more comfortable in EQN, it didn't happen. I'm not saying that a player shouldn't have the option to make their character use the mostly-revealing attire options, but that busty cleavage shouldn't be the default on the character creation screen and the focus of many sets of gear.

Nobody should have to make a male dwarf for the reasons listed. I wonder how things would be different if Linda didn't have that experience, and instead stayed as a female elf the whole time. Would the game and community be distinctly different than it is now? Would we see different SOE Fan Faire / Live cosplay?

[Stew]

I think this whole article goes a little to far in my opinions , i think thats every game and game environement have their policicy and code of coduct strict to that game and when you agree the policicy its about in game and related game contents ....

I think that pretending that you saw X or Y player saying something offensive on twitter and banned this person on everquest , DCUO , and planetside 2 as a exemple it goes Way to far .

And iam not even sure its legals , peoples pay for games and also sign an agreement and i doubt the agreement can include ( others medias ) ..

Anyones think it goes a little to far ?

Also anyones can trolls and make themself a Totalbiscuit accont somehwere and say iam total biscuit go f yourself everyones and so on ...

I think every games as to be taken apart and each agreement that player sign as to be respected in that matters

Cheaters and exploiters in game tho as to be punish no matter if they are huge outfit leader or not on thats i agree

[Tatwi]

The only accurate sweeping generalization about humanity is that there simply isn't a sweeping generalization that accurately describes humanity as a whole. I had to get old to realize this.

Throwing one's hands up and simply accepting failure is a sure fire way to perpetuate the circumstances that lead to the failure. It would be nice if these online game companies made an international community conduct standard so that, across the board, everyone would know beyond a shadow of a doubt "where the the line is" and when they've crossed it. Failure to act against it is the same as actively encouraging people to create a hostile, intolerant society. It's another one of those cases where we need to do these things "not because they are easy, but because they are hard". With games and online communities being the playground of our young people, we'd be stupid to not enforce suitable rules and to lead by example.

Granted, not all people who are callous fucks "grow up" to be social degenerates, but why risk it by letting people behave that way at all?

When one considers that there are more people in one city in China than there in many entire countries, the level of internet censorship in China starts to make a little more sense. For instance, 5,000 workers at a Foxxcon plant had what was basically a bar room brawl over a disagreement between a couple people and a plant security guard. 5,000 people... 5,000! Duking it out over something fairly inconsequential in the long run. That's pretty insane and a practical example of why it's a good idea to minimize needless negativity in large societies - shit can quickly get out of hand! And for what? Property damage and some personal injuries?

In any event, communities should be managed with honesty, integrity, and no shortage of strict frankness; "Suck it up, buttercup. It's not OK to be a dick".

[Stew]

Originally Posted by Tatwi

When one considers that there are more people in one city in China than there in many entire countries, the level of internet censorship in China starts to make a little more sense. For instance, 5,000 workers at a Foxxcon plant had what was basically a bar room brawl over a disagreement between a couple people and a plant security guard. 5,000 people... 5,000! Duking it out over something fairly inconsequential in the long run. That's pretty insane and a practical example of why it's a good idea to minimize needless negativity in large societies - shit can quickly get out of hand! And for what? Property damage and some personal injuries?

In any event, communities should be managed with honesty, integrity, and no shortage of strict frankness; "Suck it up, buttercup. It's not OK to be a dick".

You certainly show up your TR traits here , i think freedom of expression is essential for a healthy society , censorship in china is outrigth discusting , no matters if the authority dont find it ( manageable ) its still agains everything that i beleive on and its outrigth slavely and asking there peoples to shup up and dont say a words its the opposite of whats a healthy society should have ...

peoples in china basically live in the matrix


Anger is part of the human nature and when peoples have a way to express there anger you migth learn something from that anger or from a internet rant , human have whats we call feeling and they arent always nice , i know that , its part of our life

But been able to express our point of view or our feeling or opinions is truely important , bullying or dead threats are unacceptable and should be denonced and condamned ...

censorship ( especially chinease one ) as to be condamned ...

[Tatwi]

I agree that China has horrible problems with government suppression/oppression of its population, etc. however that line of chat is for another thread in a different forum.

The incident I mentioned is good example of how things can get WAY out of control due to small initial problem, which can be catastrophic when it involves a huge population. Another really good example would be the the riots in Canada after a hockey game, where property was vandalized/destroyed and people were hurt, just because the home team lost - this level of epic stupidity from a supposedly peaceful, civil society.

Aye, people get angry. Some times people get angry and don't deal with in a classy manner (/wave) and that's fine. Rage is part of what kept our ancestors alive. However, that's simply NOT what makes online communities awful. What makes them awful are the people who mean/rude/evil for the sake of doing so.

[camycamera]

hm, not really news to me, but it is a slow news day.

[Hamma]

When people start comparing situations like this to censorship in China or Japan or *Insert Country Here* I laugh. SOE is a company, just like if I decided tomorrow that I wanted to censor the word "ZOE" on PSU I could do so without repercussion, it's a private website and SOE can can do the same. If they correlate someone on Twitter who is harassing a Dev personally (for example) they are well within their rights to remove them from the community.

[Hyncharas]

Trolling is, unfortunately, not something I suspect will ever be removed from the Internet. People who do it to other users do it because they can and see it as fun in their sick, little minds, sometimes with drastic consequences. So, if the BCPs of the world get banned from our online communities for their flammable attitudes to everyone else, that's a situation of their own making and shouldn't be surprised if it happens...

In the case of sexist comments towards female game characters, however, I think users forget that even though it may be offensive to them, people rarely know what gender they are anyway unless they are publicly acknowledging it. It comes with the territory and I'm sure there are male game characters who get stereotyped by female players just as easily.

[Ghoest9]

The only "social" reasons anyone should ever be banned are real life threats, public racism, and continued harassment(by that I mean if you keep coming back and finding ways to insult an individual who doesnt want to deal with you - simply getting in an argument and calling them some names over a 5 minute period is some thing that should be dealt with by means of personal filters.)

And even public racism should result in a warning the firast time in all but the most extreme cases.

[Brusilov]

I think rudeness/abusive behaviour in general sucks! specially if its about something that should be entertaining and fun like games.

Its not needed and in my opinion below anybody who should be considered civilised.