"Specialisation" == tuning. - Page 2

Figment · 2012-07-16, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

Eh, like I said, when people actually have a chance to play the game and we are relying on more than screenshots and hearsay to fulfill our imaginations of the game these things will become more clarified in debates.

Debates themselves will end up moving from "What do you plan on specializing in?" to "Sniper Cert Build + Sidegrades v6.5". Until then we will just have to deal with the weird stuff for now.

Probably.

Problem is we're discussing here how we'd like things to be. Not just to describe how it "is", but "what do we prefer". If there's no concensus on definitions of words, feedback that is provided now won't communicate clearly to devs.

Meaning by the time we get to clearly communicate, it's probably too late to fundamentally change systems or even make large general system changes.

Especially not if there's a group that's "used to" doing something the "new way", even if this isn't the best way. Plus devs are people, people are always reluctant to change something that they've come up with first because it means they wasted time developing something else. Regardless if it's better or not.

Baneblade · 2012-07-16, 10:14 AM

We do know that certs will unlock special abilities. So Specialist isn't really a misnomer.

ArmedZealot · 2012-07-16, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by Figment

Probably.

Problem is we're discussing here how we'd like things to be. Not just to describe how it "is", but "what do we prefer". If there's no concensus on definitions of words, feedback that is provided now won't communicate clearly to devs.

Meaning by the time we get to clearly communicate, it's probably too late to fundamentally change systems or even make large general system changes.

Especially not if there's a group that's "used to" doing something the "new way", even if this isn't the best way. Plus devs are people, people are always reluctant to change something that they've come up with first because it means they wasted time developing something else. Regardless if it's better or not.

Yeah. This is the biggest reason why I would like them to have a long drawn out beta.

People are coming from a ton of backgrounds and experiences, so terms and phrases mean different things to different people. We all need to get our feet wet and get the feel of the water to get the whole community on the same footing.

Figment · 2012-07-16, 10:24 AM

A long beta would be nice and I really do hope there's going to be a point to beta beyond bug fixing, but I fear need to get microtransactions started will trump that. :/ Also because other companies like Pro7Sat.1 are waiting to make money off of the deal.

ArmedZealot · 2012-07-16, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by Figment

A long beta would be nice and I really do hope there's going to be a point to beta beyond bug fixing, but I fear need to get microtransactions started will trump that. :/ Also because other companies like Pro7Sat.1 are waiting to make money off of the deal.

From what I experienced in T:A, microtransactions can be successfully monetized before the game leaves closed beta. The "Open" closed beta really helped out T:A a ton I think and PS2 should try to emulate that. I think it kept the money coming in while keeping the game in a relatively liquid state.

Of course this is just my opinion and my experience. The devs are obviously still playing around with their microtransaction model. Just look at the recent AGN interview where higby is still entertaining the ideas of gun rentals and equipment rotations.

Tuomio · 2012-07-16, 10:35 AM

Its a mathematical fact, that sliders (PS2 type, seen from current footage) will have to have so little impact, that they will be unused and irrelevant after the shine wears away. Otherwise we would have super-characters ruling the PvP play, this is also the reason that PvP is not allowed in typical RPG MMO, where your character will gain very distinctive and broad abilities!

There are numerous single player games where this can be observed (ie. Mass effect 3). For example, knife boost 20% (being maxed out) is almost irrelevant. Might i also add, that its boring, like fiddling with Excel chart. Actually thats exactly what you are doing, changing single floating point values on a .ini file in an eye-candy fashion.

On the opposing side there is Fallout-type bonus abilities, in which you only have handful of and they give you very narrow, but sharp edges on special situations. Of course the player will then try to bring the battle in his terms, where these abilities can be used, ie. single knife slash = guaranteed kill, hand picked from 5 other options that get locked away after choice is made. This would be too powerful to be used in a have-it-all slider fashion!

PS1 also had very good and well behaved class tree, its simple and effective, thus it also gets used and gets observed from opponents point of view. It requires effort from developers side and so i am almost certain that is the reason why its not put in place here. Micropayments might also weigh in here.

Marinealver · 2012-07-16, 10:46 AM

Enginner, Scyth, Mag, HA.

ArmedZealot · 2012-07-16, 10:50 AM

Originally Posted by Marinealver

Enginner, Scyth, Mag, HA.

Unicorn, Personal shield, MA

noxious · 2012-07-16, 12:17 PM

Tuning sounds really dumb, and a one-line description of specialization within PlanetSide 2 disambiguates the term for anyone that isn't functionally retarded. The same one-line description would be necessary for the word tuning since the word doesn't really have a domain specific definition.

At any rate, I disagree that the word is problematic at all. Just because a person can do everything doesn't mean they can't specialize in one area. A programmer, for example, can often do many kinds of programming, but they will still be specialized in a small subset of areas where their knowledge and experience is primarily focused. This is exactly how specialization applies in PlanetSide 2; yes, you can do everything, but you can also specialize in a particular subset of roles by focusing your certification points on those roles.

SFJake · 2012-07-16, 12:29 PM

^^

Basically, specialization opens tuning opportunities. Someone specialized in something can tune its various options to fits its exact needs.

The use of specialization is fine.

Littleman · 2012-07-16, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by PredatorFour

Not if you only have so many cert points to spend so you cant unlock everything. I dunno why having a custom loadout is so bad compared to classes. With the TTK being short it changes alot to the original PS, when you run up to a guy with jh/av and shoot with your cycler he aint going to turn round and kill you he will be dead.

I think if we had only a certain amount of certs to spend, like in the original, it would create specialization because it would be forced. Although Higby said we can unlock everything if im not mistaken?

While I won't deny this is another term for specialization as one may recognize it, in the grand scheme of things, it's a really restrictive form of it. SOE doesn't really want people to roll 7 different characters just to enjoy every aspect of Planetside 2. That's wholly inefficient and arguably impractical for everyone.

Classes, while offering pre-determined restrictions, allow people to focus on one character (where a lot of people earn their reputations,) with the idea that classes can be balanced to prevent the super soldiers we see today. They could have restricted cert points ever so much in PS1 that the classic Rexo/HA/AV/Med/Eng setup was simply too expensive to have, but that single character would essentially be locked into that single role. They couldn't drive a tank, or fly an aircraft. You'd basically be facing a class system anyway.

Noivad · 2012-07-16, 06:25 PM

The real question lies in how long it will take to cert everything. I have heard ( Not Confirmed) it will take a year to cert all the Galaxy mods. So if one person actuallys does that then he is a specialist in Galaxy certing, but may be a noob at actually flying one with all that stuff on it. And just because you can fly a galaxy that does not mean you can fly it tactically correct to use its full potential under various conditions.

So really, depending how you look at it, there are 3 distinct specializations for a gal pilot. Cert - Flight - Tactical Deployment of a myrid of different situations and locations.

If he or she can do all that then maybe they would be called Experts.
Does it really matter what we call him if he or she can do it. Perhaps Outfit Gal pilot will do.